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Nixtreefan



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PostPosted: 04/11/17 12:11 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Gotta go with Glenn on this. By all accounts this class and next few are not any where near the caliber of prior classes. USA losses alone should demonstrate a lack of domination.

I cringe when I hear that a player can be a shooter with range as there is so much that goes into that. A player who can knock down the set shot wide open 3 right on the arc is not necessarily a shooter by definition. Shooters are guarded as such and require the ability to get shots off with further range and quicker than anyone else. They also must practice those shots at game speed, off the dribble, off the screen, pivoting off of either foot etc. True shooters always get special defensive game plans and allow others on the team to get open looks because of that defensive attention. That is why as Clay previously mentioned in other postings, they are at a premium in the game.

Take a look at the draft and you can see how many of those players are NOT shooters and if they are not at this point, there is high chance they never will be.


linkster



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PostPosted: 04/11/17 12:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:


There were perhaps unanswerable questions about how good a three point shooter she (Maya Moore) would be in college, since she played so much around the paint in high school and since her high school three point stats weren't recorded. She answered those questions almost immediately in college by shooting 42% from the arc as a freshman.

Being unsure about how good a shooter a high school player is, because of a paucity of evidence, is not the same thing as relying on existing evidence to claim that a high school player is or is not a good shooter. In the case of Megan Walker we have both. There is a paucity of evidence as to her high school three point shooting. And there is also existing USAB evidence that indicates she was a poor three point shooter (1-10) on the U18 team, plus my eyeball evidence that she was a poor three point shooter on the USAB 3x3 team (for which recorded stats are not available)

Staying just with UConn, there was a both a paucity of evidence and contrary evidence that both Gabby Williams and Napheesa Collier were effective three point shooters in high school. Williams has proved to be an ineffective three point shooter for three years in college, while Collier has begun to show increasing effectiveness during her two years of college. Both made AA first teams, however, independent of their three point shooting, functioning mostly as undersized high and low post paint players..


You claim a paucity of evidence for Maya Moore in HS and then claim that there is ample evidence for you to make an assertion about Megan Walker. You say that there is no stats for either player from HS but then you use Walker's 1-10 in USA U18 to judge her ability from behind the arc. but neglect to mention that Moore was 1-7 in her U18 play. As for 3X3, you don't even know how many 3's the entire team attempted. Like many attorneys I know you make a case for one side of an issue, in this case researching Walker's USA stats, but don't bother to present Moore's equally dismal 3 pt stats, relying instead on your prescient ability to recognize Olympian-level talent in 17 year-olds. I would be more impressed if you reported those observations while they are actually still in high school rather than after they win gold. It's always difficult to compare a player that has already developed into an Olympic quality player to another that is just exiting high school. Midway through Stewart's freshman year very few would have put her in the class of a Catchings, Taurasi or Moore.

I have no predictions for Walker. I watched some of the McAA game but I would be very reluctant to make any determinations based on that streamed game for any player and other than that I haven't seen any of the incoming freshmen.
However I do remember several posters here making assertions as to Kia Nurse's role at UConn after viewing a dubious video from the summer of her junior year in high school.


ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/12/17 9:34 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I saw Moore play as a junior and senior in high school, and as a junior, she never scored outside the paint. She didn't even attempt jumpers.

I don't believe she shot a three as a senior at the Nike TOC, once again relying on her athleticism in the paint.

Obviously, though, Moore did what very, very few players, male or female, have been able to do: Add a perimeter game in college and beyond.



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PostPosted: 04/12/17 2:02 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

not to be a jinx , but with the trend so far in college Loaded recruited classes rarely ever last long . someone is bound to transfer out just seems normal now . I hope my UT Frosh's prove me wrong though ijs



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GlennMacGrady



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PostPosted: 04/12/17 8:19 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I doubt that I would have made any claim about Maya Moore's 3pt shot in high school since I only saw her twice. I may have questioned whether she had a 3pt shot, which is a normal type of basketball inquiry. In one game I saw she scored about 47 points (agianst Tiffany Hayes' team) and in the other about 35. I recall a lot of supernatural athleticism and midrange shots, and a distinct impression that she was very, very special player. Of course, by that time in her senior year, the entire scouting and recruiting world was saying the same thing.

I have seen Megan Walker sufficiently often to have a distinct impression. I watched all of her U18 games, most of her 3x3 games, and a couple of streamed high school or AAU games. She did not play like a wing shooter, did not put up a lot of 3pt shots, and made a low percentage of her attempts. My impression is that she plays more like a small power forward -- a sort of slightly taller but less athletic Gabby Williams (which is not intended as an insult).

If someone has high school 3pt stats on Walker that belie my impression, then I'm happy to change my mind. So also, if she just hits 3pt shots at UConn.

I was just mildly surprised that Clay POY'ed her, because I thought a few players showed out better at the McD game than Walker, Westbrook had won the Wooten, and because Clay sometimes likes to dance to different tunes. However, Clay explained his thought process above.
ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/13/17 9:27 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Megan Walker is not Maya Moore, nor a guaranteed star at the college level because of her lack of a perimeter game. But if you read the story on her

http://www.maxpreps.com/news/LjvDr76Iu0CIbOoJXTTZFw/maxpreps-2016-17-national-girls-basketball-player-of-the-year--megan-walker.htm

it becomes clear she's a winner, and that counts for a lot.



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linkster



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PostPosted: 04/13/17 5:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I don't think I ever tried to compare Moore to Walker in any way other than their 3 point shooting prior to college. Walker may or may not prove to be an adequate outside shooter but IMO developing into a 30-40% spot up shooter from behind the arc is largely a matter of putting in the time and effort, especially for an elite level player.

Stewart attempted less than 30 three pt shots total in her last 2 years of high school which is well under 1 attempt per game and yet the media called her an outside threat.

Collier was 2-13 from behind the arc as a freshman and worked in to a 22-51 shooter as a sophomore.

As someone else posted, virtually all elite level high school players with any size end up scoring most of their points in the paint. Gabby Williams was the pg on her high school team but scored almost exclusively inside. I have little doubt that Walker will be at least an adequate spot up 3 pt shooter as a freshman.


GlennMacGrady



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PostPosted: 04/13/17 9:17 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I completely forgot the most recent evidence regarding Walker's 3pt shot. Just two weeks ago, I watched her be the worst 3pt performer, boy or girl, in the McDonald's skills competition. I think she made four of 25 shots in the 3pt competition, which was won for both boys and girls by Texas recruit Chasity Patterson.

https://twitter.com/ESPNU/status/846523773096464384/video/1

I have no doubt Walker will be a very good player at UConn and may very well develop a good arc shot. I've even voiced support here for the idea of her starting next season, although I don't expect that to happen.
ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/14/17 9:39 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

linkster wrote:
I don't think I ever tried to compare Moore to Walker in any way other than their 3 point shooting prior to college. Walker may or may not prove to be an adequate outside shooter but IMO developing into a 30-40% spot up shooter from behind the arc is largely a matter of putting in the time and effort, especially for an elite level player.

Stewart attempted less than 30 three pt shots total in her last 2 years of high school which is well under 1 attempt per game and yet the media called her an outside threat.

Collier was 2-13 from behind the arc as a freshman and worked in to a 22-51 shooter as a sophomore.

As someone else posted, virtually all elite level high school players with any size end up scoring most of their points in the paint. Gabby Williams was the pg on her high school team but scored almost exclusively inside. I have little doubt that Walker will be at least an adequate spot up 3 pt shooter as a freshman.


I have to disagree -- my experience has been that very, very few players can develop consistent three-point shots during or after college. Brittany Boyd is a classic example, but there are many, many smaller guards who could have literally made millions of dollars if they could have become 40% three-point shooters, and they did not.

Moore and Williams (who is an exceptional athlete, even for this level) are exceptions, but there aren't many.



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BobScoutingReport



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PostPosted: 04/14/17 4:23 pm    ::: MAxPreps rankings team and players Reply Reply with quote

https://passthaball.com/2017/04/06/pass-tha-ball-prep-polls-st-johns-emerges/

If any of you go (via copy and paste) to the above article on Pass Tha Ball, you will find a discussion of this year's final high school national rankings by the respective polls which resulted in a highly split view as to whom the number 1 team in the nation was this year.

As to National Player of the Year, it really came down to Walker and Westbrook with each getting at least one of the awards.

One thing many fans who follow rankings on the prep scene may fail to realize is that most are projections of future college success, not current high school performance as the MaxPreps (try putting this together!) list highly emphasized.

As to Boothe, she may be more talented than both Walker or Westbrook. Unfortunately, during much of Boothe's high school career showing up in dominating, refuse to lose fashion, was not a game to game occurrence.

As to Nyah Green of Texas, she was not a game to game dominator in high school this year, a future great player perhaps.

As for the Tennessee recruits, Davis, Hayes and Westbrook were all quality performers this season deserving recognition. As to the future, Tennessee needs to show that it can translate talent into big time team success as in prior decades but not done very recently.

As to Walker, it will be interesting to see how she handles being just another cog in a great team. We have seen National Freshmen of the Year (DeShields and now Slocum) cut and run even when very successful. With Connecticut loaded for next year, her transition to the next level should be worth following.


GlennMacGrady



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PostPosted: 04/16/17 1:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

If anyone wants to see Megan Walker in action with their own eyes, here is a link to the Jordan Classic played yesterday. Linkster posted a link in his thread.

https://thecube.com/event/girls-all-american-game-jordan-brand-classic-girls-726195

It ain't pretty for Walker. She went 1-11 from the floor and 0-4 on three's for a total of six points. I think I'll retract my comparison to Gabby Williams, who has always shot around 60% from the floor in her college career, albeit rarely shooting tres puntos.
ArtBest23



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PostPosted: 04/16/17 10:47 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:
If anyone wants to see Megan Walker in action with their own eyes, here is a link to the Jordan Classic played yesterday. Linkster posted a link in his thread.

https://thecube.com/event/girls-all-american-game-jordan-brand-classic-girls-726195

It ain't pretty for Walker. She went 1-11 from the floor and 0-4 on three's for a total of six points. I think I'll retract my comparison to Gabby Williams, who has always shot around 60% from the floor in her college career, albeit rarely shooting tres puntos.


The first time I noticed that was last year in the FIBA 3x3 tournament. Walker made the all tournament team and was the 2nd high scorer in the tournament, but wow, she bricked a lot of easy shots. (Actually, Amber Ramirez looked like the only player on that team with even a modicum of a shot.)

What was her high school shooting percentage? Anyone know?


GlennMacGrady



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PostPosted: 04/16/17 11:27 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ArtBest23 wrote:
GlennMacGrady wrote:
If anyone wants to see Megan Walker in action with their own eyes, here is a link to the Jordan Classic played yesterday. Linkster posted a link in his thread.

https://thecube.com/event/girls-all-american-game-jordan-brand-classic-girls-726195

It ain't pretty for Walker. She went 1-11 from the floor and 0-4 on three's for a total of six points. I think I'll retract my comparison to Gabby Williams, who has always shot around 60% from the floor in her college career, albeit rarely shooting tres puntos.


The first time I noticed that was last year in the FIBA 3x3 tournament. Walker made the all tournament team and was the 2nd high scorer in the tournament, but wow, she bricked a lot of easy shots. (Actually, Amber Ramirez looked like the only player on that team with even a modicum of a shot.)

What was her high school shooting percentage? Anyone know?


That would be informative, but I haven't found her high school or AAU stats. Sometimes, actually, stats aren't meaningful at the college level if a very good player is in a weak high school league that she easily can dominate. This is quite common, in fact.

What I've done is compile Megan Walker's stats for seven competitive games: her five games on the 2016 U18 team, the 2017 McDonald's All American game and the 2017 Jordan Brands Classic game. Here they are:

FG: 26-83 = 31.3%
3FG: 1-15 = 6.7%
FT: 14-17 = 82.3%
R: 23 = 3.3 RPG
A: 10 = 1.4 APG
TO: 9 = 1.3 TOG

These stats are for an average of about 21 minutes per game for the seven games.
acsuc99



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PostPosted: 04/17/17 2:45 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I have been severely underwhelmed by what I have seen from Meg Walker so far. High School All Star games are a dumpster fire, yes I know. And the class of 2017 has been particularly painful to watch in their ugliness. But you'd be hard pressed to find a #1 ranked player playing that underwhelming in both McDonald's/Jordan.

Good thing for her she will be like the 3rd option off the bench her frosh year.


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PostPosted: 04/17/17 8:43 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

acsuc99 wrote:
I have been severely underwhelmed by what I have seen from Meg Walker so far. High School All Star games are a dumpster fire, yes I know. And the class of 2017 has been particularly painful to watch in their ugliness. But you'd be hard pressed to find a #1 ranked player playing that underwhelming in both McDonald's/Jordan.

Good thing for her she will be like the 3rd option off the bench her frosh year.



I dont think she will have an impact on the huskies til maybe her sophmore year .



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Durantula



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PostPosted: 04/29/17 4:16 pm    ::: Re: MAxPreps rankings team and players Reply Reply with quote

BobScoutingReport wrote:
https://passthaball.com/2017/04/06/pass-tha-ball-prep-polls-st-johns-emerges/

If any of you go (via copy and paste) to the above article on Pass Tha Ball, you will find a discussion of this year's final high school national rankings by the respective polls which resulted in a highly split view as to whom the number 1 team in the nation was this year.

As to National Player of the Year, it really came down to Walker and Westbrook with each getting at least one of the awards.

One thing many fans who follow rankings on the prep scene may fail to realize is that most are projections of future college success, not current high school performance as the MaxPreps (try putting this together!) list highly emphasized.

As to Boothe, she may be more talented than both Walker or Westbrook. Unfortunately, during much of Boothe's high school career showing up in dominating, refuse to lose fashion, was not a game to game occurrence.

As to Nyah Green of Texas, she was not a game to game dominator in high school this year, a future great player perhaps.

As for the Tennessee recruits, Davis, Hayes and Westbrook were all quality performers this season deserving recognition. As to the future, Tennessee needs to show that it can translate talent into big time team success as in prior decades but not done very recently.

As to Walker, it will be interesting to see how she handles being just another cog in a great team. We have seen National Freshmen of the Year (DeShields and now Slocum) cut and run even when very successful. With Connecticut loaded for next year, her transition to the next level should be worth following.


Very informative post, please post more, your perspective on the high school game would be very welcome.


Ladyvol777



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PostPosted: 04/30/17 9:06 pm    ::: Re: MAxPreps rankings team and players Reply Reply with quote

Durantula wrote:
BobScoutingReport wrote:
https://passthaball.com/2017/04/06/pass-tha-ball-prep-polls-st-johns-emerges/

If any of you go (via copy and paste) to the above article on Pass Tha Ball, you will find a discussion of this year's final high school national rankings by the respective polls which resulted in a highly split view as to whom the number 1 team in the nation was this year.

As to National Player of the Year, it really came down to Walker and Westbrook with each getting at least one of the awards.

One thing many fans who follow rankings on the prep scene may fail to realize is that most are projections of future college success, not current high school performance as the MaxPreps (try putting this together!) list highly emphasized.

As to Boothe, she may be more talented than both Walker or Westbrook. Unfortunately, during much of Boothe's high school career showing up in dominating, refuse to lose fashion, was not a game to game occurrence.

As to Nyah Green of Texas, she was not a game to game dominator in high school this year, a future great player perhaps.

As for the Tennessee recruits, Davis, Hayes and Westbrook were all quality performers this season deserving recognition. As to the future, Tennessee needs to show that it can translate talent into big time team success as in prior decades but not done very recently.

As to Walker, it will be interesting to see how she handles being just another cog in a great team. We have seen National Freshmen of the Year (DeShields and now Slocum) cut and run even when very successful. With Connecticut loaded for next year, her transition to the next level should be worth following.


Very informative post, please post more, your perspective on the high school game would be very welcome.


Walker will never last at Uconn....


ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/30/17 10:03 pm    ::: Re: MAxPreps rankings team and players Reply Reply with quote

Ladyvol777 wrote:
Durantula wrote:
BobScoutingReport wrote:
https://passthaball.com/2017/04/06/pass-tha-ball-prep-polls-st-johns-emerges/

If any of you go (via copy and paste) to the above article on Pass Tha Ball, you will find a discussion of this year's final high school national rankings by the respective polls which resulted in a highly split view as to whom the number 1 team in the nation was this year.

As to National Player of the Year, it really came down to Walker and Westbrook with each getting at least one of the awards.

One thing many fans who follow rankings on the prep scene may fail to realize is that most are projections of future college success, not current high school performance as the MaxPreps (try putting this together!) list highly emphasized.

As to Boothe, she may be more talented than both Walker or Westbrook. Unfortunately, during much of Boothe's high school career showing up in dominating, refuse to lose fashion, was not a game to game occurrence.

As to Nyah Green of Texas, she was not a game to game dominator in high school this year, a future great player perhaps.

As for the Tennessee recruits, Davis, Hayes and Westbrook were all quality performers this season deserving recognition. As to the future, Tennessee needs to show that it can translate talent into big time team success as in prior decades but not done very recently.

As to Walker, it will be interesting to see how she handles being just another cog in a great team. We have seen National Freshmen of the Year (DeShields and now Slocum) cut and run even when very successful. With Connecticut loaded for next year, her transition to the next level should be worth following.


Very informative post, please post more, your perspective on the high school game would be very welcome.


Walker will never last at Uconn....


Why do you think so?



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