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UTenn dominates MaxPreps AA team
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GlennMacGrady



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PostPosted: 04/09/17 11:58 pm    ::: UTenn dominates MaxPreps AA team Reply Reply with quote

UTK gets three players on the five-player All American high school team selected by MaxPreps. THREE!!!

This could be because the Selector-in-Chief is a shill for, or on the payroll of, or otherwise a slobbering knee-jerk partisan for the Lady Vols. But I sorta know the guy and would deny those claims.

After we pay deserved obeisance to his Herculean task of selecting six teams and 22 honorable mention candidates, it is of course traditional -- if not mandatory on RebKell -- to quibble and pick nits.

While the S-I-C did a prescient job of selecting Sabrina Ionescu as last year's POY, my quibble this year is: How can Megan Walker, a 6-0/1 player variously described as a wing, shooting guard or small forward, be POY if she has a lousy outside shot? I base my impression on limited but not trivial evidence, having seen her on two USAB teams, a couple of streamed high school games, and the Burger Game. The girl is athletic, energetic, coordinated . . . but a heaver of bricks from beyond the midrange.

So, you might argue, is Gabby Williams, a trendy, au courant player who became a first team college All American. Touché!

And a nit pick: How about an honorable mention for Nyah Green.
tfan



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 6:14 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Don't worry about the shooting of that #1 high school recruit. The master coach Geno Auriemma will do for her outside shooting what he did for previous #1 high school recruit Tamika Williams and her poor outside shooting.


Jlcarter



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 6:40 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

With adding these trees players answer Russell and DeShields returning. I think Tennessee has a FF team. Westbrook I think will be a star.


WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 8:45 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Jlcarter wrote:
With adding these trees players answer Russell and DeShields returning. I think Tennessee has a FF team. Westbrook I think will be a star.


Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country. Throw in Cooper , Hayes , Davis , Middleton , Nared / Jackson and they sure look deep back there.



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 9:19 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It wasn't that great a year for elite players -- by which I mean surefire future Olympians -- but obviously there are a lot of good ones out there.

Evina Westbrook was really the other candidate for POY and she's not a great shooter either. And her team didn't win the state title or earn a national ranking.

Anastasia Hayes, the best player on the best team, just didn't show quite enough to be in the POY discussion.

As always, comments welcome ...

http://www.maxpreps.com/news/s9GJnwI5SU-ApTt56gPU9g/2016-17-maxpreps-girls-basketball-all-american-team-.htm



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Jlcarter



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 9:28 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
Jlcarter wrote:
With adding these trees players answer Russell and DeShields returning. I think Tennessee has a FF team. Westbrook I think will be a star.


Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country. Throw in Cooper , Hayes , Davis , Middleton , Nared / Jackson and they sure look deep back there.

Russell will have more help in the post. Holly will have a lot more options this year.


Jlcarter



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 9:30 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
It wasn't that great a year for elite players -- by which I mean surefire future Olympians -- but obviously there are a lot of good ones out there.

Evina Westbrook was really the other candidate for POY and she's not a great shooter either. And her team didn't win the state title or earn a national ranking.

Anastasia Hayes, the best player on the best team, just didn't show quite enough to be in the POY discussion.

As always, comments welcome ...

http://www.maxpreps.com/news/s9GJnwI5SU-ApTt56gPU9g/2016-17-maxpreps-girls-basketball-all-american-team-.htm

https://twitter.com/NYGHoops/status/846376060979728385


ArtBest23



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 9:55 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I saw the subject of this thread and thought to myself "if we assume DeShields had gone directly to Tenn, they could have even more appropriately written this same thing in 2013. ##1,3,8 and 42 -- even more impressive than the 2017 class."

But transfers, busts, head cases, injuries, and what did it produce?

And they still have the same coach.

There's no guarantees.


ArtBest23



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 9:59 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:

Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country.


And which of them is going to pretend to be a point guard?

Two naturals 3s with one of them play acting as a 1. That should be interesting. Russell obviously should have turned pro for all the good passes she's going to receive.


WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 10:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:

Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country.


And which of them is going to pretend to be a point guard?

Two naturals 3s with one of them play acting as a 1. That should be interesting. Russell obviously should have turned pro for all the good passes she's going to receive.


I dont think diamond will be attempting to play PG . Actually neither will be , i expect T. Cooper to run that position .



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FrozenLVFan



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 10:14 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:

Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country.


And which of them is going to pretend to be a point guard?

Two naturals 3s with one of them play acting as a 1. That should be interesting. Russell obviously should have turned pro for all the good passes she's going to receive.


I dont think diamond will be attempting to play PG . Actually neither will be , i expect T. Cooper to run that position .


Cooper, Middleton, and Hayes at PG. Not necessarily in that order.


myrtle



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 10:31 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I found it interesting that the MaxPreps top 5 are hoopgurlz 1,2,9,10,12.

And that hoopgurlz #3 is on MaxPreps 4th best team. (also that she is variously listed at 6'1" and 6'3")

Does this imply that there are two who are head and shoulders above the rest? I always wonder also about the putting together of these lists. Is it from actually watching games...or tape...or what? And it seems like a self fulfilling destiny - if you are noticed somewhere at a younger age, you are more likely to continue to be on 'the list.' If you don't play AAU, you are unlikely to ever be on anybody's list.

Just some random thoughts.



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WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 10:35 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

FrozenLVFan wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:

Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country.


And which of them is going to pretend to be a point guard?

Two naturals 3s with one of them play acting as a 1. That should be interesting. Russell obviously should have turned pro for all the good passes she's going to receive.


I dont think diamond will be attempting to play PG . Actually neither will be , i expect T. Cooper to run that position .


Cooper, Middleton, and Hayes at PG. Not necessarily in that order.


+1



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ArtBest23



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 10:44 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:

Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country.


And which of them is going to pretend to be a point guard?

Two naturals 3s with one of them play acting as a 1. That should be interesting. Russell obviously should have turned pro for all the good passes she's going to receive.


I dont think diamond will be attempting to play PG . Actually neither will be , i expect T. Cooper to run that position .


Then I guess those two won't constitute "one of the best backcourts in the country", will they. Rolling Eyes


WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 11:35 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:

Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country.


And which of them is going to pretend to be a point guard?

Two naturals 3s with one of them play acting as a 1. That should be interesting. Russell obviously should have turned pro for all the good passes she's going to receive.


I dont think diamond will be attempting to play PG . Actually neither will be , i expect T. Cooper to run that position .


Then I guess those two won't constitute "one of the best backcourts in the country", will they. Rolling Eyes


Wether Diamond is the 3 and Evina is the 2 . With Tea' At the 1 they still will have one of the best if not the Best backcourt period. Arrow



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#Occasionalwnbafan



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 1:27 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:

Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country.


And which of them is going to pretend to be a point guard?

Two naturals 3s with one of them play acting as a 1. That should be interesting. Russell obviously should have turned pro for all the good passes she's going to receive.


I dont think diamond will be attempting to play PG . Actually neither will be , i expect T. Cooper to run that position .


Then I guess those two won't constitute "one of the best backcourts in the country", will they. Rolling Eyes


Wether Diamond is the 3 and Evina is the 2 . With Tea' At the 1 they still will have one of the best if not the Best backcourt period. Arrow
I still like Harris and Cuevas-Moore as the best back court next season.
WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 1:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

#Occasionalwnbafan wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
ArtBest23 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:

Im excited to See Westbrook's & Diamond play together should be one of the best backcourts in the country.


And which of them is going to pretend to be a point guard?

Two naturals 3s with one of them play acting as a 1. That should be interesting. Russell obviously should have turned pro for all the good passes she's going to receive.


I dont think diamond will be attempting to play PG . Actually neither will be , i expect T. Cooper to run that position .


Then I guess those two won't constitute "one of the best backcourts in the country", will they. Rolling Eyes


Wether Diamond is the 3 and Evina is the 2 . With Tea' At the 1 they still will have one of the best if not the Best backcourt period. Arrow
I still like Harris and Cuevas-Moore as the best back court next season.



No offensive fire power there , if theyre considered the best backcourt then we dont have much to judge from then do we ?



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FrozenLVFan



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 2:10 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Cooper still needs to prove herself. As a freshman, she exhibited very poor decision-making, was a terrible outside shooter with poor shooting mechanics, and had an A/TO of .76. And now she's had to sit out for a season with an injury. Thinking she and an incoming freshman will be the nation's best backcourt is overly optimistic.

Based on their past work, Middleton is a better shooter, better passer, and takes better care of the ball. Unless Cooper comes in next fall looking better than she did in her freshman season, I wouldn't be surprised seeing Middleton start at PG.


summertime blues



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 2:34 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

FrozenLVFan wrote:
Cooper still needs to prove herself. As a freshman, she exhibited very poor decision-making, was a terrible outside shooter with poor shooting mechanics, and had an A/TO of .76. And now she's had to sit out for a season with an injury. Thinking she and an incoming freshman will be the nation's best backcourt is overly optimistic.

Based on their past work, Middleton is a better shooter, better passer, and takes better care of the ball. Unless Cooper comes in next fall looking better than she did in her freshman season, I wouldn't be surprised seeing Middleton start at PG.


"When I was a child, I thought as a child..." When Cooper was a freshman, she made freshman mistakes. She has had a chance to sit on the bench for a year and observe, and now is back at practice working on her technique and her decision-making. She will have a chance to show what she has learned. Hopefully she's been a good student. You are quick to condemn based on past work.

Do I think Cooper will start at the beginning of the year? No. But I know how the Tennessee system has always worked and what the players have to do when they are redshirting. They aren't allowed to just sit on the bench and watch. They have to keep stat books of various kinds, even when they're not able to play or practice. They have to watch hours and hours of tape and be able to talk about what they watched and why it did or didn't work. And when they finally do get back to practice, they practice against guys who would probably be *playing* somewhere else. I don't think Holly has changed the system very much since she took over. I expect Cooper to be significantly improved unless she's either lazy or stupid, and I don't think she's either of those. So I think she'll get the start sooner or later.



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 2:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

FrozenLVFan wrote:
Cooper still needs to prove herself. As a freshman, she exhibited very poor decision-making, was a terrible outside shooter with poor shooting mechanics, and had an A/TO of .76. And now she's had to sit out for a season with an injury. Thinking she and an incoming freshman will be the nation's best backcourt is overly optimistic.

Based on their past work, Middleton is a better shooter, better passer, and takes better care of the ball. Unless Cooper comes in next fall looking better than she did in her freshman season, I wouldn't be surprised seeing Middleton start at PG.


I think its safe to say the same can be said about middleton and shes about to be a senior. Middleton was pegged the starter the last 2 years and lost her job both times . once to cooper and to reynolds. Eventually reynolds beat out all but Cooper has more potential



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Jlcarter



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 2:40 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I think Cooper will start. Hayes will also play a lot. I think Middleton will be a 2 guard more than the point.


linkster



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 3:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

- The strangest ranking IMO is Rellah Boothe on the 4th team.

- While it looks like Tenn really landed some outstanding talent, haven't LV fans learned that freshmen aren't apparitions of Athena, emerging fully armed from the forehead of Zeus. Tenn will have 3 polished starters in Narud, DeShields and Russell, and potentially a starting pg if Cooper returns with all her skills. The freshmen? Let's wait and see how they play defense before we put 2 of them in the starting lineup.

- I've read a lot of posts on several boards questioning Walker's outside shot and it reminded me of a lot of similar things I read about 10 years ago concerning Maya Moore. Coming into her freshman year more than one poster pointed out that Moore might have trouble in college because while she did most of her HS scoring in the paint, she was too short to compete against the taller and stronger college opponents. They seemed to think Maya was too short to play inside and lacked a consistent outside shot and handle to play on the perimeter. While she never achieved the accuracy of Mosqueda-Lewis nor the ball handling skills of top guards she managed to do OK. Of course Walker could be more like DeShields and never develop an outside shot. Time will tell.


GlennMacGrady



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PostPosted: 04/10/17 11:12 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

linkster wrote:

I've read a lot of posts on several boards questioning Walker's outside shot and it reminded me of a lot of similar things I read about 10 years ago concerning Maya Moore.


There is no current comparison between Megan Walker and Maya Moore. There has not been a player in high school like Maya Moore since Maya Moore, and there may never have been a player like Maya Moore before Maya Moore. The closest may have been Tamika Catchings.

No experienced observer watching Maya in high school could have entertained serious doubts that she was of Olympic caliber. (The same could be said of Candace Parker, Elena Delle Donne, Brittney Griner and Breanna Stewart.) Maya was 125-3 in high school, won the Naismith twice, won every other NPOY award, and was on various high school AA teams since she was a freshman.

There were perhaps unanswerable questions about how good a three point shooter she would be in college, since she played so much around the paint in high school and since her high school three point stats weren't recorded. She answered those questions almost immediately in college by shooting 42% from the arc as a freshman.

Being unsure about how good a shooter a high school player is, because of a paucity of evidence, is not the same thing as relying on existing evidence to claim that a high school player is or is not a good shooter. In the case of Megan Walker we have both. There is a paucity of evidence as to her high school three point shooting. And there is also existing USAB evidence that indicates she was a poor three point shooter (1-10) on the U18 team, plus my eyeball evidence that she was a poor three point shooter on the USAB 3x3 team (for which recorded stats are not available).

Staying just with UConn, there was a both a paucity of evidence and contrary evidence that both Gabby Williams and Napheesa Collier were effective three point shooters in high school. Williams has proved to be an ineffective three point shooter for three years in college, while Collier has begun to show increasing effectiveness during her two years of college. Both made AA first teams, however, independent of their three point shooting, functioning mostly as undersized high and low post paint players.

Katie Lou Samuelson, on the other hand, has obviously been a tremendous outside shooter, and from all distances, ever since she was in 7th grade. I wouldn't say she was clearly of Olympic quality as a high school player -- and still wouldn't say that -- but she was clearly of college AA quality.

There is no chance, in my unimportant opinion, that Megan Walker will be as as good as Maya Moore in any facet of the game. She may eventually be as successful in college as Williams, Collier or Samuelson -- but her three point shooting in high school has not provided convincing evidence of that.
ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/11/17 10:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Rellah Boothe, on the MaxPreps' fourth team, illustrates the difference between some lists and others -- and no particular system is necessarily better than any other.

The MP list is based on high school performance, not college and pro potential. (That's why Ali Patberg was POY a couple years ago over Katie Lou Samuelson -- Patberg had a better year in high school (not club, not USA Basketball) and even though she didn't project like KLS, it's a high school award for me.)

First, Boothe's team lost 10 games. It's very hard for me to justify an elite high school girls' player as a first-team all-American if her team loses 10 games. (We believe their overall record was around 20-10, but not all results are reported.) IMG Academy got crushed at the La Jolla Country Day Sweet 16 by some good but not great California teams, and that shouldn't happen to a school like IMG with all that talent.

Second, Boothe's effort level is far from consistent. She showed extremely well at the Mickey D game, but you never know what you'll get in a high school game -- or even at USA Basketball. (There is even some question as to how many games she actually played for IMG. No stats are posted and the coach wouldn't return calls.)

Now on potential, Boothe is elite. A motivated Boothe is one of the best players in the country, and a motivated Boothe will be a college star and a WNBA player. On high school production, though, she fell short of the players we ranked above her, or so we judged.

Again, you pays yer money and you takes yer choice ...



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Jlcarter



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PostPosted: 04/11/17 11:53 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://twitter.com/cecil_joyce/status/851821998502289408
Anastasia Hayes a national champion.


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