RebKell's Junkie Boards
Board Junkies Forums
 
Log in Register FAQ Memberlist Search RebKell's Junkie Boards Forum Index

US bombs Syria
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    RebKell's Junkie Boards Forum Index » Area 51
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
linkster



Joined: 27 Jul 2012
Posts: 3647



Back to top
PostPosted: 04/06/17 9:53 pm    ::: US bombs Syria Reply Reply with quote

In a rush to judgement reminiscent of 911, The Tonkin Gulf, The louisitania and the "sinking" of the Maine, our government once again announces that they are striking out against evil-doers.

Oh yes, let's once again take the US government at their word. Don't question anything. Don't ask ourselves what possible reason the Assad government would commit such a provocative act when as every one agrees they were on the verge of defeating the invaders. Wouldn't it be more plausible that the US, knowing that they were losing their proxy war and desperate to involve themselves directly in the conflict would benefit from another of their famous false flag incidents? No, of course, let's just bite into the hook and wave our flags.

What really disturbs me is the way the media treats this as some sort of horror. Eighty eight killed. The Saudis kill that many wedding guests with a drone attack and the US says oops, sorry about that, our bad. Move on. Just an unfortunate mistake. The seals kill innocent women and children, making Trump look like an incompetent, and the US chalks it up to faulty intelligence. Oops, our bad.

So I guess that like the Tonkin Gulf incident we are supposed to just wave our flags and cheer the troops. And then, in ten or fifteen years, find out the truth from declassified documents.


pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 57586
Location: Where the action is


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/06/17 9:59 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Thank goodness we didn't elect that warmonger Hillary Clinton Rolling Eyes



_________________
Make lots of noise
Kiss lots of boys
Or kiss lots of girls
If that's something you're into
When the straight and narrow
Gets a little too straight
Roll up a joint, or don't
Just follow your arrow
Wherever it points, yeah
Follow your arrow
Wherever it points
justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 7082
Location: Northfield, MN


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/06/17 10:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Ugh. Suggesting that the US used chemical weapons on civilians in some sort of false flag attack is beyond the pale. Actually have a shred of evidence for such a thing before going all "Info-Wars".

Personally, I am willing to give our military and intellegence communities the benefit of the doubt and see how all of this plays out. I don't really like the idea of getting more involved in the festering quagmire that is that region right now, but I really don't know if there was any right answer to Assad using chemical weapons.



_________________
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA
pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 57586
Location: Where the action is


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/06/17 10:33 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/375609403376144384

Donald Trump wrote:
AGAIN, TO OUR VERY FOOLISH LEADER, DO NOT ATTACK SYRIA - IF YOU DO MANY VERY BAD THINGS WILL HAPPEN & FROM THAT FIGHT THE U.S. GETS NOTHING!



_________________
Make lots of noise
Kiss lots of boys
Or kiss lots of girls
If that's something you're into
When the straight and narrow
Gets a little too straight
Roll up a joint, or don't
Just follow your arrow
Wherever it points, yeah
Follow your arrow
Wherever it points
justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 7082
Location: Northfield, MN


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/06/17 10:54 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It's funny how candidates and armchair politicians all say things like that...

And then you are sitting behind the big desk and listening to all of the intellegence and policy experts while staring at pictures of gassed babies. It's very similar to the difference between the things candidate Obama said and the actions that President Obama took.

We will see what happens going forward, but airstrikes on the base where the chemical attack originated seems a fairly measured response.



_________________
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA
Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 49476



Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 12:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world?



_________________
Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
linkster



Joined: 27 Jul 2012
Posts: 3647



Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 1:28 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
Ugh. Suggesting that the US used chemical weapons on civilians in some sort of false flag attack is beyond the pale. Actually have a shred of evidence for such a thing before going all "Info-Wars".

Personally, I am willing to give our military and intellegence communities the benefit of the doubt and see how all of this plays out. I don't really like the idea of getting more involved in the festering quagmire that is that region right now, but I really don't know if there was any right answer to Assad using chemical weapons.


Did you read my post? I don't know what happened in Syria but it is a documented fact that on several occasions the US has used "beyond the pale" methods to start a war. Admiral Morrison, the commander in the Tonkin Gulf has admitted that the incident that started the Viet Nam war never happened. It was invented. All the incidents I listed were lies told by our government to it's citizens.


linkster



Joined: 27 Jul 2012
Posts: 3647



Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 1:36 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
It's funny how candidates and armchair politicians all say things like that...

And then you are sitting behind the big desk and listening to all of the intellegence and policy experts while staring at pictures of gassed babies. It's very similar to the difference between the things candidate Obama said and the actions that President Obama took.

We will see what happens going forward, but airstrikes on the base where the chemical attack originated seems a fairly measured response.


How old are you? Were you around at the start of the first Iraqi war when our leaders bought a pretty young Kuwaiti women into a congressional hearing where she described witnessing babies being dumped from their incubators by Iraqi soldiers? A few years later we find out the she was the daughter of the Kuwaiti ambassador to the US and was in DC at the time of the incident she swore she witnessed.

The Syrian war was started to oust their leader, not because he is an evil person, which he may well be, but because he doesn't want to allow a gas pipeline to be laid through his country. It's about oil. Everything we do in the middle east is about oil.


cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 10973
Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 7:36 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

indeed, we have strict rules of engagement, without which we'd be hard-pressed to separate the evil doers (them) from the righteous (us). Rolling Eyes

i'm afraid donnie little hands has thrown his ace card as a last resort to stem the Red Tide which threatens his administration. When you're the least popular new president in the history of the US, and the feds are closing in, there is nothing like a war to save your lame ass.



_________________
Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 57586
Location: Where the action is


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 7:44 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
indeed, we have strict rules of engagement, without which we'd be hard-pressed to separate the evil doers (them) from the righteous (us). Rolling Eyes

i'm afraid donnie little hands has thrown his ace card as a last resort to stem the Red Tide which threatens his administration. When you're the least popular new president in the history of the US, and the feds are closing in, there is nothing like a war to save your lame ass.


Plus bombing the people the Russians have been helping makes it look like he's not a Putin puppet.



_________________
Make lots of noise
Kiss lots of boys
Or kiss lots of girls
If that's something you're into
When the straight and narrow
Gets a little too straight
Roll up a joint, or don't
Just follow your arrow
Wherever it points, yeah
Follow your arrow
Wherever it points
cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 10973
Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 7:55 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:
indeed, we have strict rules of engagement, without which we'd be hard-pressed to separate the evil doers (them) from the righteous (us). Rolling Eyes

i'm afraid donnie little hands has thrown his ace card as a last resort to stem the Red Tide which threatens his administration. When you're the least popular new president in the history of the US, and the feds are closing in, there is nothing like a war to save your lame ass.


Plus bombing the people the Russians have been helping makes it look like he's not a Putin puppet.


A strategic bombing for sure.



_________________
Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
Luuuc



Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 18839



Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 8:27 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

This seems just as useful now as it was when it was published:
9 questions about Syria you were too embarrassed to ask



_________________
Seems rike no one takes me serirousreee
justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 7082
Location: Northfield, MN


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 8:29 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

linkster wrote:
justintyme wrote:
Ugh. Suggesting that the US used chemical weapons on civilians in some sort of false flag attack is beyond the pale. Actually have a shred of evidence for such a thing before going all "Info-Wars".

Personally, I am willing to give our military and intellegence communities the benefit of the doubt and see how all of this plays out. I don't really like the idea of getting more involved in the festering quagmire that is that region right now, but I really don't know if there was any right answer to Assad using chemical weapons.


Did you read my post? I don't know what happened in Syria but it is a documented fact that on several occasions the US has used "beyond the pale" methods to start a war. Admiral Morrison, the commander in the Tonkin Gulf has admitted that the incident that started the Viet Nam war never happened. It was invented. All the incidents I listed were lies told by our government to it's citizens.

That is a total false equivalency.

Do I believe our country's leaders might make up an event to sell a war to the American people? Absolutely. Though I still would want actual evidence of this, not just wild conjecture. It's the same thing I demand of Trump when he throws out half-baked conspiracy theories about Obama wire tapping him or Obama being a secret Muslim...

But even then, what I was saying was beyond the pale was the idea that the US would actually use chemical weapons on children as a false flag attact to justify war. I just don't see that happening, and would beed some serious evidence of it occuring before I would even entertain the thought.



_________________
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA
justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 7082
Location: Northfield, MN


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 8:36 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world?

For the moment, and for this one action of bombing that one military installation. And I support his call for the removal of Assad, just as Obama did. I would not support any large scale unilateral action going forward akin to what we did in Iraq.

As I said, so far this was a measured response. I have no issue with that. Just because I find Trump disgusting doesn't mean I can't look at things objectively.



_________________
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA
cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 10973
Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 8:54 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
Shades wrote:
Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world?

For the moment, and for this one action of bombing that one military installation. And I support his call for the removal of Assad, just as Obama did. I would not support any large scale unilateral action going forward akin to what we did in Iraq.

As I said, so far this was a measured response. I have no issue with that. Just because I find Trump disgusting doesn't mean I can't look at things objectively.



Illegal bombing done to distract the US population. See the corporate media fulfill its duty.

Trump condemns chemical weapon warfare while denying victims of it safety in US.



_________________
Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 7082
Location: Northfield, MN


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 9:02 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
justintyme wrote:
Shades wrote:
Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world?

For the moment, and for this one action of bombing that one military installation. And I support his call for the removal of Assad, just as Obama did. I would not support any large scale unilateral action going forward akin to what we did in Iraq.

As I said, so far this was a measured response. I have no issue with that. Just because I find Trump disgusting doesn't mean I can't look at things objectively.



Illegal bombing done to distract the US population. See the corporate media fulfill its duty.

Trump condemns chemical weapon warfare while denying victims of it safety in US.

Not sure how it is considered "illegal". So far it is well within his authority. Hell, Hillary Clinton had just said that she would do something similar...

As far as everything else, they are inconsequential to the logic of whether or not the action taken was appropriate. It is possible to both support (or at least not oppose) a specific action while still condeming other actions taken by that individual. I think Trump's policies for the most part are utterly disgusting.



_________________
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA
cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 10973
Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 9:03 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Trump tells Putin, Putin tells Assad, Syrian and Russian troops and equipment moved, missiles launched, Trump tells NSC and congress.



_________________
Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 10973
Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 9:05 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:
justintyme wrote:
Shades wrote:
Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world?

For the moment, and for this one action of bombing that one military installation. And I support his call for the removal of Assad, just as Obama did. I would not support any large scale unilateral action going forward akin to what we did in Iraq.

As I said, so far this was a measured response. I have no issue with that. Just because I find Trump disgusting doesn't mean I can't look at things objectively.



Illegal bombing done to distract the US population. See the corporate media fulfill its duty.

Trump condemns chemical weapon warfare while denying victims of it safety in US.

Not sure how it is considered "illegal". So far it is well within his authority. Hell, Hillary Clinton had just said that she would do something similar...

As far as everything else, they are inconsequential to the logic of whether or not the action taken was appropriate. It is possible to both support (or at least not oppose) a specific action while still condeming other actions taken by that individual. I think Trump's policies for the most part are utterly disgusting.


How is it not?



_________________
Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 7082
Location: Northfield, MN


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 9:24 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:


How is it not?

Because there is no law against it?

Incidentally, I also supported Clinton’s belief that the US should establish a no-fly zone (which this would actually be a part of) over the area. Trump was very much against this idea during the campaign. How silly would it be for me to now oppose this just because Trump is the person doing it? If Bernie Sanders were president, and he ordered this sort of strike would you still oppose it? Because I am willing to bet he would have.



_________________
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA
cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 10973
Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 9:30 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:


How is it not?

Because there is no law against it?

Incidentally, I also supported Clinton’s belief that the US should establish a no-fly zone (which this would actually be a part of) over the area. Trump was very much against this idea during the campaign. How silly would it be for me to now oppose this just because Trump is the person doing it. [b]If Bernie Sanders were president, and he ordered this sort of strike would you still oppose it? Because I am willing to bet he would have[/b].


There is no law prohibiting bombing a sovereign nation that is not at war with the U.S.? Shocked


I doubt Bernie would do this. And if he did, I'd condemn it.



_________________
Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 7082
Location: Northfield, MN


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 10:21 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:

There is no law prohibiting bombing a sovereign nation that is not at war with the U.S.? Shocked

No. Not really. "International Law" is not this super codified thing like people seem to think. There are some specifics signed on through the Geneva convention and the like, but most things are not cut and dried. Based upon the US's position in this battle it would be a very hard case to make that they broke any law.

And you don't see any president, Sanders included, ordering the disablement of a military base used to stage chemical weapon attacks?



_________________
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA
justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 7082
Location: Northfield, MN


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 10:37 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Now, if people want a good place to attack Trump it is on his budget proposals.

For instance this airstrike cost about $93.81 million (Tomahawk Missles cost about 1.5 million each, according to the DoD).

Yet Trump feels the need to cut the NEA, which has a total annual budget of $146.2 million.



_________________
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA
cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 10973
Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 11:08 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:

There is no law prohibiting bombing a sovereign nation that is not at war with the U.S.? Shocked

No. Not really. "International Law" is not this super codified thing like people seem to think. There are some specifics signed on through the Geneva convention and the like, but most things are not cut and dried. Based upon the US's position in this battle it would be a very hard case to make that they broke any law.

And you don't see any president, Sanders included, ordering the disablement of a military base used to stage chemical weapon attacks?



A friendly heads-up: the primary is over so you can stop with the Sanders sideswipes. Smile

This "measured response" apparently left the runway intact and hit no chemicals. It's only mission was to bump the criminal's favorability numbers and distract from the Russian probe.



_________________
Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
linkster



Joined: 27 Jul 2012
Posts: 3647



Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 11:14 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:

There is no law prohibiting bombing a sovereign nation that is not at war with the U.S.? Shocked

No. Not really. "International Law" is not this super codified thing like people seem to think. There are some specifics signed on through the Geneva convention and the like, but most things are not cut and dried. Based upon the US's position in this battle it would be a very hard case to make that they broke any law.

And you don't see any president, Sanders included, ordering the disablement of a military base used to stage chemical weapon attacks?


Like torturing enemy combatants? Remember, the US has refused to sign the Geneva conventions.

Here's a concise and compelling view of this bombing:
https://dailyreckoning.com/neocons-gotten-trump/

I can't understand why you don't think the US would intentionally murder innocent civilians, including women and children. Who do you think were living in those Afghan & Pakistani villages that we hit with missiles in order to kill some tribal leader we "thought" was there? Hell, we killed a few of these leaders 3 or 4 times over the years.

Who ever is in the white house is irrelevant.


justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 7082
Location: Northfield, MN


Back to top
PostPosted: 04/07/17 11:18 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
justintyme wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:

There is no law prohibiting bombing a sovereign nation that is not at war with the U.S.? Shocked

No. Not really. "International Law" is not this super codified thing like people seem to think. There are some specifics signed on through the Geneva convention and the like, but most things are not cut and dried. Based upon the US's position in this battle it would be a very hard case to make that they broke any law.

And you don't see any president, Sanders included, ordering the disablement of a military base used to stage chemical weapon attacks?



A friendly heads-up: the primary is over so you can stop with the Sanders sideswipes. Smile

This "measured response" apparently left the runway intact and hit no chemicals. It's only mission was to bump the criminal's favorability numbers and distract from the Russian probe.

I am, and was, a huge Sanders supporter. I voted for him in the Minnesota primary. So I am definitely not taking swipes at him. I was using him to point out that the action taken here is not "hawkish" behavior but is rather measured, at least so far. Going forward this could change, depending on what Trump decides to do.

If the attack failed to achieve its objectives, that is a different issue and fair to criticize in regards to its execution. However it shouldn't be conflated with whether or not the strike was the correct decision to begin with, as that is the fallacy of outcome bias.



_________________
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    RebKell's Junkie Boards Forum Index » Area 51 All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB 2.0.17 © 2001- 2004 phpBB Group
phpBB Template by Vjacheslav Trushkin