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linkster
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 Posted: 04/06/17 9:53 pm ::: US bombs Syria |
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In a rush to judgement reminiscent of 911, The Tonkin Gulf, The louisitania and the "sinking" of the Maine, our government once again announces that they are striking out against evil-doers.
Oh yes, let's once again take the US government at their word. Don't question anything. Don't ask ourselves what possible reason the Assad government would commit such a provocative act when as every one agrees they were on the verge of defeating the invaders. Wouldn't it be more plausible that the US, knowing that they were losing their proxy war and desperate to involve themselves directly in the conflict would benefit from another of their famous false flag incidents? No, of course, let's just bite into the hook and wave our flags.
What really disturbs me is the way the media treats this as some sort of horror. Eighty eight killed. The Saudis kill that many wedding guests with a drone attack and the US says oops, sorry about that, our bad. Move on. Just an unfortunate mistake. The seals kill innocent women and children, making Trump look like an incompetent, and the US chalks it up to faulty intelligence. Oops, our bad.
So I guess that like the Tonkin Gulf incident we are supposed to just wave our flags and cheer the troops. And then, in ten or fifteen years, find out the truth from declassified documents.
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pilight
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justintyme
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| Posted: 04/06/17 10:28 pm ::: |
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Ugh. Suggesting that the US used chemical weapons on civilians in some sort of false flag attack is beyond the pale. Actually have a shred of evidence for such a thing before going all "Info-Wars".
Personally, I am willing to give our military and intellegence communities the benefit of the doubt and see how all of this plays out. I don't really like the idea of getting more involved in the festering quagmire that is that region right now, but I really don't know if there was any right answer to Assad using chemical weapons.
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pilight
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| Posted: 04/06/17 10:33 pm ::: |
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https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/375609403376144384
| Donald Trump wrote: |
| AGAIN, TO OUR VERY FOOLISH LEADER, DO NOT ATTACK SYRIA - IF YOU DO MANY VERY BAD THINGS WILL HAPPEN & FROM THAT FIGHT THE U.S. GETS NOTHING! |
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Follow your arrow
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justintyme
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| Posted: 04/06/17 10:54 pm ::: |
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It's funny how candidates and armchair politicians all say things like that...
And then you are sitting behind the big desk and listening to all of the intellegence and policy experts while staring at pictures of gassed babies. It's very similar to the difference between the things candidate Obama said and the actions that President Obama took.
We will see what happens going forward, but airstrikes on the base where the chemical attack originated seems a fairly measured response.
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Shades
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| Posted: 04/07/17 12:10 am ::: |
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| Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world?
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linkster
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| Posted: 04/07/17 1:28 am ::: |
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| justintyme wrote: |
Ugh. Suggesting that the US used chemical weapons on civilians in some sort of false flag attack is beyond the pale. Actually have a shred of evidence for such a thing before going all "Info-Wars".
Personally, I am willing to give our military and intellegence communities the benefit of the doubt and see how all of this plays out. I don't really like the idea of getting more involved in the festering quagmire that is that region right now, but I really don't know if there was any right answer to Assad using chemical weapons. |
Did you read my post? I don't know what happened in Syria but it is a documented fact that on several occasions the US has used "beyond the pale" methods to start a war. Admiral Morrison, the commander in the Tonkin Gulf has admitted that the incident that started the Viet Nam war never happened. It was invented. All the incidents I listed were lies told by our government to it's citizens.
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linkster
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| Posted: 04/07/17 1:36 am ::: |
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| justintyme wrote: |
It's funny how candidates and armchair politicians all say things like that...
And then you are sitting behind the big desk and listening to all of the intellegence and policy experts while staring at pictures of gassed babies. It's very similar to the difference between the things candidate Obama said and the actions that President Obama took.
We will see what happens going forward, but airstrikes on the base where the chemical attack originated seems a fairly measured response. |
How old are you? Were you around at the start of the first Iraqi war when our leaders bought a pretty young Kuwaiti women into a congressional hearing where she described witnessing babies being dumped from their incubators by Iraqi soldiers? A few years later we find out the she was the daughter of the Kuwaiti ambassador to the US and was in DC at the time of the incident she swore she witnessed.
The Syrian war was started to oust their leader, not because he is an evil person, which he may well be, but because he doesn't want to allow a gas pipeline to be laid through his country. It's about oil. Everything we do in the middle east is about oil.
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cthskzfn
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pilight
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cthskzfn
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Luuuc
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justintyme
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| Posted: 04/07/17 8:29 am ::: |
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| linkster wrote: |
| justintyme wrote: |
Ugh. Suggesting that the US used chemical weapons on civilians in some sort of false flag attack is beyond the pale. Actually have a shred of evidence for such a thing before going all "Info-Wars".
Personally, I am willing to give our military and intellegence communities the benefit of the doubt and see how all of this plays out. I don't really like the idea of getting more involved in the festering quagmire that is that region right now, but I really don't know if there was any right answer to Assad using chemical weapons. |
Did you read my post? I don't know what happened in Syria but it is a documented fact that on several occasions the US has used "beyond the pale" methods to start a war. Admiral Morrison, the commander in the Tonkin Gulf has admitted that the incident that started the Viet Nam war never happened. It was invented. All the incidents I listed were lies told by our government to it's citizens. |
That is a total false equivalency.
Do I believe our country's leaders might make up an event to sell a war to the American people? Absolutely. Though I still would want actual evidence of this, not just wild conjecture. It's the same thing I demand of Trump when he throws out half-baked conspiracy theories about Obama wire tapping him or Obama being a secret Muslim...
But even then, what I was saying was beyond the pale was the idea that the US would actually use chemical weapons on children as a false flag attact to justify war. I just don't see that happening, and would beed some serious evidence of it occuring before I would even entertain the thought.
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justintyme
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| Posted: 04/07/17 8:36 am ::: |
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| Shades wrote: |
| Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world? |
For the moment, and for this one action of bombing that one military installation. And I support his call for the removal of Assad, just as Obama did. I would not support any large scale unilateral action going forward akin to what we did in Iraq.
As I said, so far this was a measured response. I have no issue with that. Just because I find Trump disgusting doesn't mean I can't look at things objectively.
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cthskzfn
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| Posted: 04/07/17 8:54 am ::: |
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| justintyme wrote: |
| Shades wrote: |
| Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world? |
For the moment, and for this one action of bombing that one military installation. And I support his call for the removal of Assad, just as Obama did. I would not support any large scale unilateral action going forward akin to what we did in Iraq.
As I said, so far this was a measured response. I have no issue with that. Just because I find Trump disgusting doesn't mean I can't look at things objectively. |
Illegal bombing done to distract the US population. See the corporate media fulfill its duty.
Trump condemns chemical weapon warfare while denying victims of it safety in US.
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justintyme
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| Posted: 04/07/17 9:02 am ::: |
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| cthskzfn wrote: |
| justintyme wrote: |
| Shades wrote: |
| Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world? |
For the moment, and for this one action of bombing that one military installation. And I support his call for the removal of Assad, just as Obama did. I would not support any large scale unilateral action going forward akin to what we did in Iraq.
As I said, so far this was a measured response. I have no issue with that. Just because I find Trump disgusting doesn't mean I can't look at things objectively. |
Illegal bombing done to distract the US population. See the corporate media fulfill its duty.
Trump condemns chemical weapon warfare while denying victims of it safety in US. |
Not sure how it is considered "illegal". So far it is well within his authority. Hell, Hillary Clinton had just said that she would do something similar...
As far as everything else, they are inconsequential to the logic of whether or not the action taken was appropriate. It is possible to both support (or at least not oppose) a specific action while still condeming other actions taken by that individual. I think Trump's policies for the most part are utterly disgusting.
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cthskzfn
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| Posted: 04/07/17 9:03 am ::: |
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| Trump tells Putin, Putin tells Assad, Syrian and Russian troops and equipment moved, missiles launched, Trump tells NSC and congress.
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cthskzfn
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| Posted: 04/07/17 9:05 am ::: |
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| justintyme wrote: |
| cthskzfn wrote: |
| justintyme wrote: |
| Shades wrote: |
| Justin has been siding with Trump? What in the world? |
For the moment, and for this one action of bombing that one military installation. And I support his call for the removal of Assad, just as Obama did. I would not support any large scale unilateral action going forward akin to what we did in Iraq.
As I said, so far this was a measured response. I have no issue with that. Just because I find Trump disgusting doesn't mean I can't look at things objectively. |
Illegal bombing done to distract the US population. See the corporate media fulfill its duty.
Trump condemns chemical weapon warfare while denying victims of it safety in US. |
Not sure how it is considered "illegal". So far it is well within his authority. Hell, Hillary Clinton had just said that she would do something similar...
As far as everything else, they are inconsequential to the logic of whether or not the action taken was appropriate. It is possible to both support (or at least not oppose) a specific action while still condeming other actions taken by that individual. I think Trump's policies for the most part are utterly disgusting. |
How is it not?
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justintyme
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| Posted: 04/07/17 9:24 am ::: |
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| cthskzfn wrote: |
How is it not? |
Because there is no law against it?
Incidentally, I also supported Clinton’s belief that the US should establish a no-fly zone (which this would actually be a part of) over the area. Trump was very much against this idea during the campaign. How silly would it be for me to now oppose this just because Trump is the person doing it? If Bernie Sanders were president, and he ordered this sort of strike would you still oppose it? Because I am willing to bet he would have.
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justintyme
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justintyme
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| Posted: 04/07/17 10:37 am ::: |
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Now, if people want a good place to attack Trump it is on his budget proposals.
For instance this airstrike cost about $93.81 million (Tomahawk Missles cost about 1.5 million each, according to the DoD).
Yet Trump feels the need to cut the NEA, which has a total annual budget of $146.2 million.
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