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| Who will be FOY? |
| Lauren Cox - Baylor |
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4% |
[ 3 ] |
| Joyner Holmes - Texas |
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16% |
[ 10 ] |
| Crystal Dangerfield - UConn |
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3% |
[ 2 ] |
| Sabrina Ionescu - Oregon |
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25% |
[ 16 ] |
| Erin Boley - Notre Dame |
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6% |
[ 4 ] |
| Destiny Slocum - Maryland |
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19% |
[ 12 ] |
| Natalie Chou - Baylor |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| Leeona Odom - Duke |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| Tori McCoy - Ohio St. |
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1% |
[ 1 ] |
| Jackie Young - Notre Dame |
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9% |
[ 6 ] |
| Amber Ramirez - TCU |
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3% |
[ 2 ] |
| Nancy Mulkey - Oklahoma |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| Anna Wilson - Stanford |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| Felicia Aiyeotan - Virginia |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| Someone else (who?) |
|
9% |
[ 6 ] |
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| Total Votes : 62 |
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| Author |
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63761
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 Posted: 01/09/17 7:03 pm ::: |
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She's baaaaaaack!
<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/xgyKe0IKLZE" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012
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| Posted: 02/16/17 1:33 pm ::: |
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Ionescu should win it but like all PAC12 players, their performances occur after the East coast media outlets have closed their books for the night and become "old news" by the next day. That and the lack of games shown on ESPN. Both poor reasons for denying her the award but real reasons nevertheless.
One likely alternative is Joyner Holmes, who started the season slowly but who has really developed into a dominant force. Her game against Baylor was outstanding and although she started slowly against Fla St she came on late in the game and was a big factor at the end.
I'm not sure when the awards are announced but I'd guess that more Texas games will be televised nationally between now and then than Oregon games.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
Posts: 14550
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| Posted: 02/16/17 3:20 pm ::: |
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Holmes is actually dominating games and is a major reason Texas has won 19 in a row including wins over Baylor and FSU, and are ranked in the top 10.
Ionescu is putting up stats but they've lost 9 games and are unranked.
Holmes seems like a slam dunk choice to me.
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IM in OC
Joined: 25 Mar 2009
Posts: 999
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: 02/16/17 3:57 pm ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
Holmes is actually dominating games and is a major reason Texas has won 19 in a row including wins over Baylor and FSU, and are ranked in the top 10.
Ionescu is putting up stats but they've lost 9 games and are unranked.
Holmes seems like a slam dunk choice to me. |
Holmes plays in a conference that doesnt get me excited for being competitive. Only 2 good teams, Baylor and UT, and one respectable team, in Oklahoma. The rest are not much, and that includes KSU.
Ionescu missed 3 losses with an injury so she has been involved in 6 loses to Holmes 4. Not much difference IMO.
Holmes v Good teams
Stanford 3pts
Miss St 9
So Car 11
UConn 6
Tenn 12
Baylor 18
Okla 20
Ionescu v Good Teams
Miss St 14
Stanford 14
Cal(ranked#20 when game played)13
Or State 14 and 21
ASU 16
UCLA 11 and 18
By the way, what does Oregon, not being ranked, have to with someone is in the running for FOY?
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
Posts: 14550
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| Posted: 02/16/17 4:23 pm ::: |
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| IM in OC wrote: |
Ionescu v Good Teams
Miss St 14 - LOSS
Stanford 14 - LOSS
Cal(ranked#20 when game played)13 - RPI 68, who cares
Or State 14 and 21 LOSS AND LOSS
ASU 16 - LOSS
UCLA 11 and 18. ONE WIN, ONE LOSS
By the way, what does Oregon, not being ranked, have to with someone is in the running for FOY? |
Holmes is performing not to generate stats but to win big games. I'm not impressed by big numbers in loss after loss after loss. That one player is driving her team's high ranking is extremely important to FOY consideration in my book. Leading your team to big wins matters.
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63761
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| Posted: 02/16/17 4:28 pm ::: |
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I don't believe National FOY is determined by how highly ranked are their teams, just like team success isn't a factor in ROY in the WNBA.
If you believe it matters, I guess the award should be handed to Slocum of #2 ranked Maryland.
Texas is right around preseason projections, while Maryland is little better than projections, and it's hard to argue that Oregon isn't doing better than projections. Just ask myrtle. 
As far as losing games, Oregon lost the game where Ionescu went down with a thumb injury 7 min into the game. They lost 2 of the 4 games she didn't play at all. So counting 7 min as not playing, Oregon lost 60% of the games Ionescu didn't play. They're 15-6 (71.4%) in games Ionescu did play.
As far as individual accolades go, not only is 4 triple doubles amazing, it's historic. And considering the games where she was out with injury, that's 4 triple doubles on 21 games she had the opportunity to play full minutes. What have the other freshman done that is comparable?
Now I'll just finish with most recent accolades.
| Quote: |
IONESCU SWEEPS PAC-12 AWARDS
On Monday Sabrina Ionescu became just the second player in Pac-12 history to win both the league's player and freshman of the week at the same time. Ionescu posted a triple-double against UCLA and a double-double against USC to help Oregon sweep the LA schools at home for the second time in three seasons.
IONESCU NATIONAL PLAYER OF THE WEEK
In addition to her Pac-12 honors, Sabrina Ionescu was named the USBWA Ann Meyers Drysdale national player of the week on Tuesday. |
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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
Last edited by Shades on 02/16/17 5:47 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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IM in OC
Joined: 25 Mar 2009
Posts: 999
Location: Orange County, CA
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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Durantula
Joined: 30 Mar 2013
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| Posted: 02/16/17 7:42 pm ::: |
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On the flip side can't one argue that Holmes has a better surrounding cast than Ionescu? There is a benefit and drawback to playing on a bad team. Ionescu maybe can play through mistakes more because they don't have the depth that Texas has.
For these reasons I prefer just to look at stats instead of judging team quality. I would pick Ionescu as of now, although I don't think she is the best freshman, but maybe the most valuable to her team.
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RavenDog
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 6878
Location: Home
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| Posted: 02/17/17 12:07 am ::: |
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At this point in time I'd guess:
1. Slocum
2. Holmes
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 2815
Location: New York
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| Posted: 02/17/17 8:16 am ::: |
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| RavenDog wrote: |
At this point in time I'd guess:
1. Slocum
2. Holmes |
I vote Joyner Holmes. Just on the eye test alone. Slocum and Ionescu are right behind her.
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63761
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| Posted: 02/17/17 8:57 am ::: |
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http://www.sportswriters.net/usbwa/news/2017/meyers170214.html
| Quote: |
OREGON'S IONESCU IS ANN MEYERS
DRYSDALE NATIONAL PLAYER OF THE WEEK
ST. LOUIS (USBWA) – The U.S. Basketball Writers Association has selected Oregon freshman guard Sabrina Ionescu as its Ann Meyers Drysdale Women's National Player of the Week for games ending the week of Sunday, Feb. 12. The USBWA's weekly honor will be handed out each Tuesday through mid-February this season.
As the Pac-12 Conference Player of the Week, Ionescu was nominated for the weekly award, which was chosen by Mel Greenberg, the USBWA coordinator for women's basketball, from a list of Division I conference players of the week.
Ionescu, a 5-10 freshman guard from Walnut Creek, Calif., who was also the Pac-12 freshman of the week (the second time a dual honor given in league history), averaged 16.5 points and 10.5 rebounds for the week. She had an Oregon record fourth career triple-double – already breaking the career mark of Bev Smith – in the 84-75 upset of UCLA with 11 points, 10 assists and 10 rebounds.
Since the 1987-88 season, the USBWA has named a women’s National Player of the Year. At the Women’s NCAA Final Four in Denver, 2012, the organization announced going forward that the national and weekly player award has been named for Hall of Famer and former UCLA All-American Ann Meyers Drysdale. At the conclusion of the regular season, the USBWA will name finalists for the award, which is voted on by the entire membership of the USBWA. The winner of the 2017 Ann Meyers Drysdale National Player of the Year will be announced and presented at the USBWA’s annual awards event in Dallas, site of the 2017 NCAA Women’s Final Four.
2016-17 Ann Meyers Drysdale National Players of the Week
• Week ending Dec. 11: Napheesa Collier, UConn (American Athletic Conference)
• Week ending Dec. 18: Alaina Coates, South Carolina (Southeastern Conference)
• Week ending Dec. 25: Kristine Anigwe, California (Pac-12 Conference)
• Week ending Jan. 1: Ty Petty, Middle Tennessee (Conference USA)
• Week ending Jan. 8: Kelsey Plum, Washington (Pac-12 Conference USA)
• Week ending Jan. 15: Brionna Jones, Maryland (Big Ten Conference USA)
• Week ending Jan. 22: Katie Lou Samuelson, UConn (American Athletic Conference)
• Week ending Jan. 29: Camille Zimmerman, Columbia (Ivy League)
• Week ending Feb. 5: Jennie Simms, Old Dominion (Conference USA)
• Week ending Feb. 12: Sabrina Ionescu, Oregon (Pac-12 Conference) |
Only freshman I see on this list.
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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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readyAIMfire53
Joined: 20 Nov 2004
Posts: 7370
Location: Durham, NC
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| Posted: 02/17/17 5:43 pm ::: |
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| ucbart wrote: |
| RavenDog wrote: |
At this point in time I'd guess:
1. Slocum
2. Holmes |
I vote Joyner Holmes. Just on the eye test alone. Slocum and Ionescu are right behind her. |
It is a 3 player race, with a few games plus conference tourneys to go. All 3 are VERY impressive and light years beyond any other frosh. Perhaps the last few games will move one above the other two. I know I've seen Ionescu less than the other two and if I were officially voting on this, I'd have to even that up.
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Fighting Artichoke
Joined: 12 Dec 2012
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| Posted: 02/18/17 7:18 pm ::: |
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| Right now I think it's Sabrina, but that could change. Obviously the FOY does not need to come from a winning team, as last year it was Kristine Anigwe. I guess that goes against the West Coast bias hypothesis as well.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 02/18/17 7:50 pm ::: |
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In light of the discussion here, Doris Burke said during a broadcast today that most times in individual awards she is voting to reward winning, and votes for the person who is having a great season on the team that is doing great things.
I don't typically agree with Doris, and think she may overstate this, but I think that great performances that lead to wins mean a lot more than meaningless stats in losing efforts. Indeed I am often left wondering whether if the player with the big stats hadn't so dominated the ball her team might have performed better and maybe won some of those games.
Last edited by ArtBest23 on 02/18/17 7:52 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Fighting Artichoke
Joined: 12 Dec 2012
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| Posted: 02/18/17 7:52 pm ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
In light of the discussion here, Doris Burke said during a broadcast today that most times in individual awards she is voting to award winning, and votes for the person who is having a great season on the team that is doing great things.
I don't typically agree with Doris, and think she may overstate this, but I think that great performances that lead to wins mean a lot more than meaningless stats in losing efforts. Indeed I am often left wondering whether if the player with the big stats hadn't so dominated the ball her team might have performed better and maybe won some of those games. |
I don't disagree with this.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 02/19/17 1:30 pm ::: |
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"Winning" is a simple word at one level, but complicated at another.
Does it mean the number of wins?
Does it mean the number of actual wins over expected wins?
Does it mean wins over quality opponents?
Does it mean the won-loss record when the player was hurt as opposed to when the player was healthy?
I'm sure there are more options ...
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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| Posted: 03/25/17 1:57 pm ::: |
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| Any questions? Good....
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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008
Posts: 32335
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| Posted: 03/25/17 3:30 pm ::: |
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| Shades wrote: |
| Any questions? Good.... |
seems pretty definitive, doesn't it?
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