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cthskzfn



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 9:25 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:
jammerbirdi wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
Being that the child was unarmed...


OMG no you didn't say that. Wow. That's about the most disingenuous and manipulative thing I've heard said by anyone so far anywhere.

I am OUT. Rolling Eyes


What exactly was wrong about that.

Sorry. Did I put it in perspective for you? You've been calling the kid (Yes..the kid) a violent criminal throughout the thread. Talk about being disingenuous.


BTW: apparently the KKK has been running around Ferguson. Haven't seen them on the news much though.



While I'm clearly not on the side jammer seems to be, his description of Brown, while antagonistic, is at least as accurate- and it can be argued that it is more so- than your "unarmed child".

Brown is 18. He is a young man, figuratively and legally. He is a very large young man. He robbed a store and bullied, w/ his overwhelming physical size, the store owner. That makes him violent, and a petty thief in my mind. And, a punk.

I have argued here before, many times, re: what I view as outrageous police action/overreaction, much of it race-motivated. The recent militaristic-style build-up of local police forces is a bad, bad thing imo. (It coincides w/ the recent "thank you for your service" worship of all people military/"war on terrorism" fear-mongering, imo, but that's another discussion).

Brown, as much as I can be sure, as much of an asshole I think he was, should not have been killed. The cop, as much as I can be sure, is the ultimate asshole for allowing/causing the escalation and, obviously, causing Brown's death.

The prosecutor is the scumbag icing on this uniquely American, forked-up cake.



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sambista



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 11:11 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

i wouldn't say it's uniquely american.



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Ex-Ref



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 11:41 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

An article about NO Saints player Benjamin Watson's Facebook post. The post is linked in the article. Very interesting post.

http://www.newsday.com/sports/football/benjamin-watson-new-orleans-saints-te-has-ferguson-facebook-message-go-viral-1.9655172


mercfan3



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 11:50 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
jammerbirdi wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
Being that the child was unarmed...


OMG no you didn't say that. Wow. That's about the most disingenuous and manipulative thing I've heard said by anyone so far anywhere.

I am OUT. Rolling Eyes


What exactly was wrong about that.

Sorry. Did I put it in perspective for you? You've been calling the kid (Yes..the kid) a violent criminal throughout the thread. Talk about being disingenuous.


BTW: apparently the KKK has been running around Ferguson. Haven't seen them on the news much though.



While I'm clearly not on the side jammer seems to be, his description of Brown, while antagonistic, is at least as accurate- and it can be argued that it is more so- than your "unarmed child".

Brown is 18. He is a young man, figuratively and legally. He is a very large young man. He robbed a store and bullied, w/ his overwhelming physical size, the store owner. That makes him violent, and a petty thief in my mind. And, a punk.

I have argued here before, many times, re: what I view as outrageous police action/overreaction, much of it race-motivated. The recent militaristic-style build-up of local police forces is a bad, bad thing imo. (It coincides w/ the recent "thank you for your service" worship of all people military/"war on terrorism" fear-mongering, imo, but that's another discussion).

Brown, as much as I can be sure, as much of an asshole I think he was, should not have been killed. The cop, as much as I can be sure, is the ultimate asshole for allowing/causing the escalation and, obviously, causing Brown's death.

The prosecutor is the scumbag icing on this uniquely American, forked-up cake.


He was a high school student, days before he was killed. That's a child to me. I don't care if he was a big kid. I don't care if he was an asshole kid (how many 18 year old boys are assholes? So..so..many..). He was a recent high school graduate. That's a kid.

We have no problem calling the white high school boys, who rape and film their classmates, kids. (And we also like to talk about how sad it is that they get in trouble. That they had such a bright future. And it's too bad they'll have to miss the football season.) We have no problem labeling the white college guys who shoot up their colleges kids. (Obviously it wasn't their fault, they are sick.)

Language is important. Call the victim what he was.



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Ex-Ref



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 11:54 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
jammerbirdi wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
Being that the child was unarmed...


OMG no you didn't say that. Wow. That's about the most disingenuous and manipulative thing I've heard said by anyone so far anywhere.

I am OUT. Rolling Eyes


What exactly was wrong about that.

Sorry. Did I put it in perspective for you? You've been calling the kid (Yes..the kid) a violent criminal throughout the thread. Talk about being disingenuous.


BTW: apparently the KKK has been running around Ferguson. Haven't seen them on the news much though.



While I'm clearly not on the side jammer seems to be, his description of Brown, while antagonistic, is at least as accurate- and it can be argued that it is more so- than your "unarmed child".

Brown is 18. He is a young man, figuratively and legally. He is a very large young man. He robbed a store and bullied, w/ his overwhelming physical size, the store owner. That makes him violent, and a petty thief in my mind. And, a punk.

I have argued here before, many times, re: what I view as outrageous police action/overreaction, much of it race-motivated. The recent militaristic-style build-up of local police forces is a bad, bad thing imo. (It coincides w/ the recent "thank you for your service" worship of all people military/"war on terrorism" fear-mongering, imo, but that's another discussion).

Brown, as much as I can be sure, as much of an asshole I think he was, should not have been killed. The cop, as much as I can be sure, is the ultimate asshole for allowing/causing the escalation and, obviously, causing Brown's death.

The prosecutor is the scumbag icing on this uniquely American, forked-up cake.


He was a high school student, days before he was killed. That's a child to me. I don't care if he was a big kid. I don't care if he was an asshole kid (how many 18 year old boys are assholes? So..so..many..). He was a recent high school graduate. That's a kid.

We have no problem calling the white high school boys, who rape and film their classmates, kids. (And we also like to talk about how sad it is that they get in trouble. That they had such a bright future. And it's too bad they'll have to miss the football season.) We have no problem labeling the white college guys who shoot up their colleges kids. (Obviously it wasn't their fault, they are sick.)

Language is important. Call the victim what he was.


FWIW, HS teams around here are called "men's XXXXXX team" and "women's XXXXXX team.
"


justintyme



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 11:57 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Ex-Ref wrote:
An article about NO Saints player Benjamin Watson's Facebook post. The post is linked in the article. Very interesting post.

http://www.newsday.com/sports/football/benjamin-watson-new-orleans-saints-te-has-ferguson-facebook-message-go-viral-1.9655172

Excellent post. He sums up perfectly the situation as I see it. This is the type of constructive argument that needs to be heard more.



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cthskzfn



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 12:36 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
jammerbirdi wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
Being that the child was unarmed...


OMG no you didn't say that. Wow. That's about the most disingenuous and manipulative thing I've heard said by anyone so far anywhere.

I am OUT. Rolling Eyes


What exactly was wrong about that.

Sorry. Did I put it in perspective for you? You've been calling the kid (Yes..the kid) a violent criminal throughout the thread. Talk about being disingenuous.


BTW: apparently the KKK has been running around Ferguson. Haven't seen them on the news much though.



While I'm clearly not on the side jammer seems to be, his description of Brown, while antagonistic, is at least as accurate- and it can be argued that it is more so- than your "unarmed child".

Brown is 18. He is a young man, figuratively and legally. He is a very large young man. He robbed a store and bullied, w/ his overwhelming physical size, the store owner. That makes him violent, and a petty thief in my mind. And, a punk.

I have argued here before, many times, re: what I view as outrageous police action/overreaction, much of it race-motivated. The recent militaristic-style build-up of local police forces is a bad, bad thing imo. (It coincides w/ the recent "thank you for your service" worship of all people military/"war on terrorism" fear-mongering, imo, but that's another discussion).

Brown, as much as I can be sure, as much of an asshole I think he was, should not have been killed. The cop, as much as I can be sure, is the ultimate asshole for allowing/causing the escalation and, obviously, causing Brown's death.

The prosecutor is the scumbag icing on this uniquely American, forked-up cake.


He was a high school student, days before he was killed. That's a child to me. I don't care if he was a big kid. I don't care if he was an asshole kid (how many 18 year old boys are assholes? So..so..many..). He was a recent high school graduate. That's a kid.

We have no problem calling the white high school boys, who rape and film their classmates, kids. (And we also like to talk about how sad it is that they get in trouble. That they had such a bright future. And it's too bad they'll have to miss the football season.) We have no problem labeling the white college guys who shoot up their colleges kids. (Obviously it wasn't their fault, they are sick.)

Language is important. Call the victim what he was.



I'm pretty sure I suggested that, to the best of my knowledge, Brown was a victim of an over-reactive, racist police action.

Agree re: language- Brown was an 18-yr old, college-bound petty thief/bully. What part of that language isn't true, exactly?

And just because he was, doesn't mean he (so obvious, don't know why I have to say it) deserved to be killed. Or that his death is less tragic. Or that his life is less valuable.

As for the white boys you mention- i have no idea what YOU called them, and you are equally ignorant of my description of them. Smile



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cthskzfn



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 12:43 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

sambista wrote:
i wouldn't say it's uniquely american.



Ok, I didn't realize there's another country suffering the same karma descended from a 16-19th century slave system.

Where else does this shit happen for that reason?



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pilight



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 12:48 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
sambista wrote:
i wouldn't say it's uniquely american.



Ok, I didn't realize there's another country suffering the same karma descended from a 16-19th century slave system.

Where else does this shit happen for that reason?


Almost all western countries held and traded slaves in the 16th-19th century. That much is certainly not uniquely American.



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Howee



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 12:52 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
sambista wrote:
i wouldn't say it's uniquely american.


Ok, I didn't realize there's another country suffering the same karma descended from a 16-19th century slave system.

Where else does this shit happen for that reason?


Time Frames and systems are less relevant than the pervasive culture of One Class/Race Above The Rest. See: India (caste system) Latin American/Caribbean Cultures (slave systems), Ancient Rome, et. al.

The only unique part is that this is *our* experience. And as dismal as it seems, I still say *our* time and setting offers more actual hope for reform than in some of those places named above.



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jammerbirdi



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 1:40 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:


Language is important. Call the victim what he was.


Shocked Yes. Of course. What was I thinking? He was a child.



And when the police confront criminals on society's behalf, and those criminals violently attack those same police and reach into their vehicles and punch them in the face with 6'6" and 300 lbs of might, threatening a takeover of the weaponry of the police, let's remember how important language really is and call those criminals what they are.

Victims.



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justintyme



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 2:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

jammerbirdi wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:


Language is important. Call the victim what he was.


Shocked Yes. Of course. What was I thinking? He was a child.

And when the police confront criminals on society's behalf, and those criminals violently attack those same police and reach into their vehicles and punch them in the face with 6'6" and 300 lbs of might, threatening a takeover of the weaponry of the police, let's remember how important language really is and call those criminals what they are.

Victims.


As with most labels, it is possible he is both and neither simultaneously. No label is ever perfect as people are not objects. People are not consistently one thing or another. And most importantly, people are different things to different people. To say one is right and one is wrong is problematic.



What labels would you use for the guy in the first picture, and what would you use for the one in the second? This is why trying to say someone "is" something pretty much sucks all around.



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justintyme



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 2:34 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:

There was easily enough evidence to indict him. Perhaps not enough to find him guilty, but indict. As someone else said, you can indict a ham sandwich. There was enough to satisfy probable cause, which is actually a relatively low burden.

And it's pathetic, because as was pointed out, the Prosecutor led the proceedings in a way that it was evident that this case was about to be dropped. Not only that, but realistically, this was a racial case..and there just so happened to be enough white people on the jury to not indict him.


In a normal setting, this never gets to the grand jury. The prosecutor would look at the totality of the evidence involved and then use his or her own discretion on whether or not they felt that there was:

1. Probable cause that a crime had been committed
2. A reasonable chance of conviction

The reason for that "ham sandwich" statement is because by the time they get to the grand jury a prosecutor has already weeded out the cases of no probable cause. They then just present the evidence that supports their case and leave out anything detrimental.

Due to the sensitive nature of this subject, there was an attempt at transparency. Instead of the prosecutor deciding on his own that there was no probable cause he turned it over to the jury. They got to weigh all the evidence that he would normally weigh in making that decision. They ended up agreeing with his take on it.

I keep hearing that the prosecutor is supposed to be an "agent for the victim". That is not true at all. He is supposed to be an agent for justice. We don't want prosecutors railroading people who they don't honestly feel are guilty. So here he took a hands off approach. A cynic might call him a coward who wanted to cover his behind. Someone with more faith in humanity might say he was a decent person who wanted to make sure that he was making the correct decision so he allowed 12 people to draw their own conclusions. I am not in his head, and I don't know him personally, so I cannot say which one it was.



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TonyL222



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 2:52 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It is the grand jurys function not to enquire upon what foundation [the charge may be] denied, or otherwise to try the suspects defenses, but only to examine upon what foundation [the charge] is made by the prosecutor. Respublica v. Shaffer, 1 Dall. 236 (O. T. Phila. 1788); see also F. Wharton, Criminal Pleading and Practice 360, pp. 248-249 (8th ed. 1880). As a consequence, neither in this country nor in England has the suspect under investigation by the grand jury ever been thought to have a right to testify or to have exculpatory evidence presented. Justice Anthony Scalia, 1992 Supreme Court case of United States v. Williams.

Wilson testified for hours in his own defense. The St. Louis prosecutor said the GJ weighed the testimony of eye witnesses against exculpatory witness accounts and the forensic evidence. None of that should have happened. All of that should have occurred during a trial.

This prosecutor did not want to have his officer bring charges against and have to prosecute this police officer.


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PostPosted: 11/26/14 4:27 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
sambista wrote:
i wouldn't say it's uniquely american.



Ok, I didn't realize there's another country suffering the same karma descended from a 16-19th century slave system.

Where else does this shit happen for that reason?


well, brasil, for one, though i'm sure there are others. save for a few variances, the fundamental engines of racism and classism are here. remember, brasil was the last major country where slavery was abolished, 23 years after the u.s. brasil feels like 1980s america to me in that sense. it's been only about 10 years since a law abolishing "elevator apartheid" was enacted, allowing blacks (and maids, black or otherwise) to use the "social" elevators instead of the service elevators. i remember coming here in the '90s and being automatically directed to the rear of hotels, well-dressed as i was, though i politely begged to differ and was allowed normal passage once it became clear i was american.

there's a song here that talks about black people, and poor people, and poor amounting to being black. in the favelas, people are shot first, with no intention of asking questions later. in fact, some just disappear. on the street, if you wear the "wrong" clothes, assumptions are made.

and that military gear ferguson police marched out with? hell, that's standard issue here. i was crossing the street at the beach one quiet sunday, and a police officer was waving his (semiautomatic?) rifle at me and others, and all he was doing was directing traffic and pedestrians! i was shocked, frightened and stunned. there was no incident or disturbance. but he was decked out as if for war on a sunny sunday at the beach. standard issue. now, it just so happened that there were quite a few black people getting off a bus . . .

and let's talk about europe for a second. i'm not into soccer, but i sure did hear about and see the banana thrown on the field at the dark-skinned player. and the banners the players held up at the beginning of games and the tv spots during the world cup imploring "no racism." does it matter that europe's anguish is about immigrants? no. different words, same story.



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cthskzfn



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 4:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:
sambista wrote:
i wouldn't say it's uniquely american.



Ok, I didn't realize there's another country suffering the same karma descended from a 16-19th century slave system.

Where else does this shit happen for that reason?


Almost all western countries held and traded slaves in the 16th-19th century. That much is certainly not uniquely American.


That much I was aware of, as well as "the darker-the-skin-the-lower-the-class" reality in this hemisphere.

I guess the uniqueness is the bullshit rhetoric vs the despicable reality?

But, I will retract. Cool



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 7:27 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
Due to the sensitive nature of this subject, there was an attempt at transparency. Instead of the prosecutor deciding on his own that there was no probable cause he turned it over to the jury. They got to weigh all the evidence that he would normally weigh in making that decision. They ended up agreeing with his take on it.


The more I read about the grand jury proceedings, the less I think this is true. It appears that his questioning of Wilson was pretty darned gentle, and often led to answers that would help Wilson. (For instance, and I'm paraphrasing here, "Did you have a reasonable fear for your life?") There was very little follow-up when Wilson's testimony was inconsistent with physical evidence, such as the distance between the car and where Brown was when he died. Other witnesses who were more inclined to say things that would have supported an indictment got much more severe treatment, more or less like cross examination.

All of this is consistent with my view that the goal of the grand jury proceeding was *not* transparency at all, but instead was to protect the prosecutor from criticism that he didn't charge Wilson. That doesn't mean that Wilson should have been charged, but it does mean that, to quote a Facebook friend of mine, the prosecutor was a pompous doofus (or worse).


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PostPosted: 11/26/14 9:20 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote










p_d_swanson



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 9:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

beknighted wrote:
All of this is consistent with my view that the goal of the grand jury proceeding was *not* transparency at all, but instead was to protect the prosecutor from criticism that he didn't charge Wilson. That doesn't mean that Wilson should have been charged, but it does mean that, to quote a Facebook friend of mine, the prosecutor was a pompous doofus (or worse).

"Right from the beginning, when Governor Jay Nixon refused to name a special prosecutor and left the case in the hands of Bob McCulloch, the greasy and hopelessly conflicted local district attorney, this case was headed for the biggest public fix since the 1919 World Series."

-- Pierce


beknighted



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 10:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

p_d_swanson wrote:
beknighted wrote:
All of this is consistent with my view that the goal of the grand jury proceeding was *not* transparency at all, but instead was to protect the prosecutor from criticism that he didn't charge Wilson. That doesn't mean that Wilson should have been charged, but it does mean that, to quote a Facebook friend of mine, the prosecutor was a pompous doofus (or worse).

"Right from the beginning, when Governor Jay Nixon refused to name a special prosecutor and left the case in the hands of Bob McCulloch, the greasy and hopelessly conflicted local district attorney, this case was headed for the biggest public fix since the 1919 World Series."

-- Pierce


Charles Pierce is a treasure.


Barrister15



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PostPosted: 11/26/14 11:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

In US v. Williams, Scalia, in his majority opinion stated "It is the grand jurys function not to enquire upon what foundation [the charge may be] denied, or otherwise to try the suspects defenses, but only to examine upon what foundation [the charge] is made by the prosecutor. Respublica v. Shaffer, 1 Dall. 236 (O. T. Phila. 1788); see also F. Wharton, Criminal Pleading and Practice 360, pp. 248-249 (8th ed. 1880). As a consequence, neither in this country nor in England has the suspect under investigation by the grand jury ever been thought to have a right to testify or to have exculpatory evidence presented."

That Wilson testified at the grand jury is not unusual -- certainly defendants testify at the grand jury all the time (and usually against the advice of counsel). That he testified for hours at the behest of the prosecution, and that the prosecution presented exculpatory evidence to the grand jury is what made these proceedings so suspect. That McCulloch brought this to the grand jury at all just proved to be lip service to those who called for Wilson to face charges -- the unorthodox way he presented the case to the grand jury, contrary to hundreds of years of American jurisprudence, was a slap in the face to the Brown family and a disservice to the memory of the unarmed young man whose life was lost.

You can characterize Mike Brown however you'd like -- call him a bully, call him a violent criminal -- but no matter what you call him, he didn't deserve a death sentence.

People of color have every right to be angry. With every Mike Brown. With every Ramarley Graham. With every Amadou Diallo, Eric Garner, Sean Bell, and Kimane Gray. With every Akai Gurley. With every unarmed black male felled by a police officer's bullet, that anger grows and grows and grows. If you're not angry about this, you're not paying attention.


beknighted



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PostPosted: 11/27/14 12:03 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Barrister15 wrote:
People of color have every right to be angry. With every Mike Brown. With every Ramarley Graham. With every Amadou Diallo, Eric Garner, Sean Bell, and Kimane Gray. With every Akai Gurley. With every unarmed black male felled by a police officer's bullet, that anger grows and grows and grows. If you're not angry about this, you're not paying attention.


And yet every incident is deemed to be individual and separate by some people, as if there isn't a pattern. (Speaking of which, I just read today, in a Straight Dope column about whether particular ethnic groups drive better or worse than others [no], that blacks get stopped much more often by the police than whites, but also get let go without a ticket or arrest much more often. Sounds like cops going fishing to me.)


Barrister15



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PostPosted: 11/27/14 1:27 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

beknighted wrote:

And yet every incident is deemed to be individual and separate by some people, as if there isn't a pattern. (Speaking of which, I just read today, in a Straight Dope column about whether particular ethnic groups drive better or worse than others [no], that blacks get stopped much more often by the police than whites, but also get let go without a ticket or arrest much more often. Sounds like cops going fishing to me.)


Driving while black. It's like an automotive version of stop and frisk.

When you consider how many unarmed people of color suspected of committing low level offenses are killed by the police, while armed whites who are suspected of committing heinous acts of violence are taken into custody alive, how can there not be some sort of pattern? If Jared Loughner was black, would he be alive and awaiting trial? Or would he have been shot by police the second they had a clear shot?


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PostPosted: 11/27/14 5:47 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Barrister15 wrote:


You can characterize Mike Brown however you'd like -- call him a bully, call him a violent criminal -- but no matter what you call him, he didn't deserve a death sentence.


But he didn't get a death sentence. A death sentence is imposed by a court and a jury in criminal cases that society has deemed merit capital punishment.

Mike Brown initiated a violent assault on a police officer while that police officer was seated inside his own vehicle. He repeatedly punched the officer and grabbed at his weapon. A half dozen black eyewitnesses have said so. And during that violent altercation which he initiated he was shot multiple times and died. Given other circumstances that would be almost a written prescription for attempting suicide by cop.

He physically attacked an armed police officer. That is very stupid thing to do. This cop, any cop, is going to fight for his life. A cop is always going to assume one thing, that he's at risk of being killed. They are on guard all the time. They are trained to have in the front of their minds at all time the possibly that a perpetrator might take their own weapons from them and kill them. There is always a gun in the presence of a violent criminal that they're encountering. THEIR gun. This is a tremendous fear throughout the law enforcement community.

So when anyone attacks a cop or fights with a cop, they're giving that cop the green light to waste their stupid ass. They might not know it. But that's their fucking problem.

20 minutes before he was killed Michael Brown was the bad ass bully terrorizing a convenience store employee (owner) threatening a beat down to a human being half his size. We don't give a SHIT about the humiliation, the emasculation, that that little guy undoubtedly experienced when he couldn't do his job of protecting his store and his inventory from a giant thug.

So he called the cops. Because people aren't supposed to have to live like that. You aren't supposed to have to feel that powerless and that vulnerable in America to a guy just because he's bigger and stronger than you. He doesn't GET to walk into your place of business and just TAKE what he wants. And when you confront him those kinds of individuals don't get to cower you with their hulking physicality.

That's where the police come in. We hope. You call the cops when you have been victimized by such a a piece of shit as this dumb fuck was. And it is hoped (I would hope) by everyone here that the cops would have come to this small business owner's rescue and rounded up these two assholes and charged them with whatever they did. Nothing more and nothing less. It's how we maintain order in this country. And pubic safety.

All the myriad fixes we need in this country to try to right this ship, many involving fixing law enforcement and a broken legal system, we're STILL going to need cops to run down strong arm convenience store robbers who have only snatched a box of cigarillos. Because people need to feel safe and BE safe in their homes and places of business. No exceptions.



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Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
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PostPosted: 11/27/14 6:28 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Barrister15 wrote:

People of color have every right to be angry. With every Mike Brown. With every Ramarley Graham. With every Amadou Diallo, Eric Garner, Sean Bell, and Kimane Gray. With every Akai Gurley. With every unarmed black male felled by a police officer's bullet, that anger grows and grows and grows. If you're not angry about this, you're not paying attention.


I made a website about a dozen years ago (or more) to publicize questionable killings of black and hispanic people in California. (I think I remember asking some people in this group to visit it.) That's ALL the website was about. The police shooting blacks and hispanics. It doesn't take mere anger to make a website attacking the police and calling them murderers and cowards. It takes FURY.

Point is... my dismay and disgust that all this has been brought about by the shooting of Michael Brown... THIS cop, this guy, this incident... it's NOT because I'm indifferent to this issue in general. On the contrary. This issue used to be at the top of my list. It would be still if not for the country being so incredibly fucked up that this is now just one of dozens of incredibly fucked up problems.



_________________
Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
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