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nsw43
Joined: 20 Aug 2010
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 Posted: 04/03/12 9:57 pm ::: Where do Natalie Novosel and Dev Peters stand? |
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| These two players' performances in the final game were pretty terrible. Will this do anything to their draft prospects, or is the draft so weak that they'll still go in the first round?
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GEF34
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| Posted: 04/03/12 10:05 pm ::: |
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Why should one game determine whether or not their stock rises or drops, yes I know it's the "biggest" game of the year, but they also played in the "biggest game of the year last season and they had great game, so it's not as if this was the only time the were on the biggest stage and the fumbled, they did show the can play well there. But with that said, how high was their stock to begin with?_________________ DeLisha Milton-Jones is my favorite player 
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pilight
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| Posted: 04/03/12 10:10 pm ::: |
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I never thought Novosel was much of a prospect.
Peters has a little potential. She might go late first.
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wadethered
Joined: 28 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/03/12 10:10 pm ::: |
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| IMO, they're still both 1st rounders. I just can't think of more than 10 players that are better prospects than either of them.
Last edited by wadethered on 04/03/12 10:38 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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FS02
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
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| Posted: 04/03/12 10:12 pm ::: |
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| People have been watching them for a long time, so I doubt it will affect them much.
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Rock Hard
Joined: 02 Aug 2010
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| Posted: 04/03/12 10:28 pm ::: |
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| I have a question for everyone. Which player will get drafted first, Novosel or Wojta?
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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| Posted: 04/03/12 10:29 pm ::: |
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| Rock Hard wrote: |
| I have a question for everyone. What player will get drafted first, Novosel or Wojta? |
Should be Wojta.
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Last edited by pilight on 04/04/12 10:27 am; edited 1 time in total |
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toad455
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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| Posted: 04/03/12 11:09 pm ::: |
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| Peters should be a mid-first round pick, where Novosel should be mid to late first round. I don't see either player going earlier than #7.
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mavcarter
Joined: 02 Sep 2010
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| Posted: 04/03/12 11:09 pm ::: |
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| GEF34 wrote: |
| Why should one game determine whether or not their stock rises or drops, yes I know it's the "biggest" game of the year, but they also played in the "biggest game of the year last season and they had great game |
Exactly.
If Novosel does make a roster it will be because of her three point shooting and being able to get to the basket because defensively she is really bad.
If Peters had a brain she could be good, if a team is looking for a good rebounder/ defender and foul specialist she's your girl.
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bullsky
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: 04/03/12 11:28 pm ::: |
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Novosel I think has the better chance, but still they're pretty low.
Peters can't stay in games. She constantly commits stupid fouls. WNBA refs would have a field day with her.
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Rock Hard
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| Posted: 04/03/12 11:41 pm ::: |
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| A large chunk of WNBA refs also work Division I women's college basketball games.
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dynasty0207
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| Posted: 04/03/12 11:44 pm ::: |
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| With the WNBA playing a more physical style, Peters might get away with more. Also, she will have 6 fouls to commit and her role on a team will be small so I doubt any foul trouble of hers would matter too much.
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GEF34
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| Posted: 04/03/12 11:46 pm ::: |
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| dynasty0207 wrote: |
| With the WNBA playing a more physical style, Peters might get away with more. Also, she will have 6 fouls to commit and her role on a team will be small so I doubt any foul trouble of hers would matter too much. |
That's a good point, being a big body who goes after the ball aggressively teams might be more interested in her to have an extra body off the bench to be aggressive while their starters get a little break._________________ DeLisha Milton-Jones is my favorite player
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blaase22
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| Posted: 04/03/12 11:55 pm ::: |
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| bullsky wrote: |
Novosel I think has the better chance, but still they're pretty low.
Peters can't stay in games. She constantly commits stupid fouls. WNBA refs would have a field day with her. |
I think Peters will easily make a roster and with the right team (Indiana,SA, Mystics or Shock) will get minutes.
I don't see Novosel making a roster unless she gets drafted by the Mystics or Shock.
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tfan
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| Posted: 04/04/12 8:05 am ::: |
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| Does Peters have a jump shot?
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pilight
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| Posted: 04/04/12 8:18 am ::: |
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| tfan wrote: |
| Does Peters have a jump shot? |
No. She's a low grade version of DeMya Walker.
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caune
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| Posted: 04/04/12 9:25 am ::: |
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| blaase22 wrote: |
I don't see Novosel making a roster unless she gets drafted by the Mystics or Shock. |
Or the Mercury. She'd fit in Phoenix. Not advocating for her but she has the tools they look for
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myrtle
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| Posted: 04/04/12 3:08 pm ::: |
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Novosel will go in the first round and historically 1st rounders make their teams. [Just ask Pilight] This year could be an anomaly to that, but I'm guessing she at least gets that 11th spot, at least for a year. She has a great, very tough attitude and her shooting, while it looked terribly at the F4, is generally much better than that.
And to a previous post: Anyone who thinks Stricklen can play PG is sorely mistaken. Have you actually watched her handle the ball? I actually don't think she can dribble well enough to play the 2. And she also is not really a PF -yea she can post up smaller players but that's about the only aspect you could stretch it to include. So IMO she is straight up a SF. When her shot is on, she's awesome. When it's not, she's awesomely bad.
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CamrnCrz1974
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/04/12 3:17 pm ::: |
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| myrtle wrote: |
| And to a previous post: Anyone who thinks Stricklen can play PG is sorely mistaken. Have you actually watched her handle the ball? I actually don't think she can dribble well enough to play the 2. And she also is not really a PF -yea she can post up smaller players but that's about the only aspect you could stretch it to include. So IMO she is straight up a SF. When her shot is on, she's awesome. When it's not, she's awesomely bad. |
Announcers and fans think if you bring the ball up the court, you are "playing the point" or you are " demonstrating point guard skills." Saying such a thing demonstrates either a fundamental lack of knowledge of the sport (specifically, the position) or a need to demonstrate how great the women's game is by making every player seem some fundamentally sound and versatile enough to play multiple positions.
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Richyyy
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| Posted: 04/04/12 3:31 pm ::: |
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I like Novosel: she's crafty, and 'finding ways to score' really is a skill, and not one that's as common as you might think. But when you're a perimeter player without a high level of athleticism, it really can be hard to survive at WNBA level. I'm intrigued to see how she does, but wouldn't be surprised if she's more successful in Europe than the US as a pro.
On the bright side for Peters, you get 6 fouls in the WNBA instead of 5, and when you're a backup foul trouble doesn't matter as much. On the negative side, there's a lot more competition and being dumb as a post will get you cut when you're a marginal player. She can probably help if she finds the right fit - how many chances has Felicia freaking Chester already had, for crying out loud? - but she might not find it immediately. |
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stats47
Joined: 18 Jan 2010
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| Posted: 04/04/12 4:03 pm ::: |
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| GEF34 wrote: |
| Why should one game determine whether or not their stock rises or drops |
Wasn't a scoreless championship game one of the main reasons Jayne Appel dropped to #5 in the 2010 draft? Not advocating it, just saying it happens...
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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| Posted: 04/04/12 4:07 pm ::: |
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| stats47 wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| Why should one game determine whether or not their stock rises or drops |
Wasn't a scoreless championship game one of the main reasons Jayne Appel dropped to #5 in the 2010 draft? Not advocating it, just saying it happens... |
I thought it was because she was injured not her performance in the one game. Yes the performance was partly due to the the injury, but if she was fully healthy and had a bad performance she might not have dropped. Of course we'll never know, but I always thought her drop was due to her injury._________________ DeLisha Milton-Jones is my favorite player
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stats47
Joined: 18 Jan 2010
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| Posted: 04/04/12 4:11 pm ::: |
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| GEF34 wrote: |
| stats47 wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| Why should one game determine whether or not their stock rises or drops |
Wasn't a scoreless championship game one of the main reasons Jayne Appel dropped to #5 in the 2010 draft? Not advocating it, just saying it happens... |
I thought it was because she was injured not her performance in the one game. Yes the performance was partly due to the the injury, but if she was fully healthy and had a bad performance she might not have dropped. Of course we'll never know, but I always thought her drop was due to her injury. |
I believe she didn't reveal the extent of her injury until the day of the draft...but you're right in that we won't know the reasoning of the GMs.
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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| Posted: 04/04/12 4:14 pm ::: |
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| stats47 wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| stats47 wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| Why should one game determine whether or not their stock rises or drops |
Wasn't a scoreless championship game one of the main reasons Jayne Appel dropped to #5 in the 2010 draft? Not advocating it, just saying it happens... |
I thought it was because she was injured not her performance in the one game. Yes the performance was partly due to the the injury, but if she was fully healthy and had a bad performance she might not have dropped. Of course we'll never know, but I always thought her drop was due to her injury. |
I believe she didn't reveal the extent of her injury until the day of the draft...but you're right in that we won't know the reasoning of the GMs. |
I don't remember when she revealed the extent, but I do remember she was very badly hurt during Pac-10 season, and didn't she also miss most of game during the NCAA Tournament because of the injury, she fell on it or something. Even though she didn't reveal the extent, it was very clear she was badly injury and playing through the pain._________________ DeLisha Milton-Jones is my favorite player
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bballfan2005
Joined: 22 Aug 2005
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| Posted: 04/04/12 4:41 pm ::: |
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| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
| myrtle wrote: |
| And to a previous post: Anyone who thinks Stricklen can play PG is sorely mistaken. Have you actually watched her handle the ball? I actually don't think she can dribble well enough to play the 2. And she also is not really a PF -yea she can post up smaller players but that's about the only aspect you could stretch it to include. So IMO she is straight up a SF. When her shot is on, she's awesome. When it's not, she's awesomely bad. |
Announcers and fans think if you bring the ball up the court, you are "playing the point" or you are " demonstrating point guard skills." Saying such a thing demonstrates either a fundamental lack of knowledge of the sport (specifically, the position) or a need to demonstrate how great the women's game is by making every player seem some fundamentally sound and versatile enough to play multiple positions. |
THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Nerd2
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| Posted: 04/04/12 7:14 pm ::: |
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| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
| myrtle wrote: |
| And to a previous post: Anyone who thinks Stricklen can play PG is sorely mistaken. Have you actually watched her handle the ball? I actually don't think she can dribble well enough to play the 2. And she also is not really a PF -yea she can post up smaller players but that's about the only aspect you could stretch it to include. So IMO she is straight up a SF. When her shot is on, she's awesome. When it's not, she's awesomely bad. |
Announcers and fans think if you bring the ball up the court, you are "playing the point" or you are " demonstrating point guard skills." Saying such a thing demonstrates either a fundamental lack of knowledge of the sport (specifically, the position) or a need to demonstrate how great the women's game is by making every player seem some fundamentally sound and versatile enough to play multiple positions. |
So I am one of those fans, based on never having played basketball and relying on the announcers to teach me the game. So how about a primer for someone like me? How can I tell when someone is actually playing point guard asa opposed to bringing the ball up and initiating the offense?
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ClayK
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| Posted: 04/05/12 9:31 am ::: |
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Novosel: So imagine it's late in the game, tie score, and Cappie Pondexter is bringing the ball up -- and she's being guarded by Natalie Novosel. And then, after Pondexter scores, Novosel is guarded by Pondexter.
Peters: How tall is she? She's slender, so if she's not a legit 6-2, I can't see her surviving in the WNBA paint. Ashley Walker, at 6-1, was one of the best rebounders I've ever seen, but she just wasn't big enough to make it. I don't think Peters has a perimeter game, so she has to make it happen inside, and if Walker couldn't, can she?
Point guard: A point guard
a) creates shots for herself or her teammates, in and out of the offensive sets, whether by scoring or passing; and
b) makes passes that do not require the potential shooter to move her hands to catch the ball. If a shooter has to reach for a pass, it pretty much means the ensuing shot will be missed; but if the pass hits her right in her shooting pocket, the percentages go way up. Being off by six inches is more than enough to cause problems.
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ucdt3
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| Posted: 04/05/12 11:20 am ::: |
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| Nerd2 wrote: |
| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
| myrtle wrote: |
| And to a previous post: Anyone who thinks Stricklen can play PG is sorely mistaken. Have you actually watched her handle the ball? I actually don't think she can dribble well enough to play the 2. And she also is not really a PF -yea she can post up smaller players but that's about the only aspect you could stretch it to include. So IMO she is straight up a SF. When her shot is on, she's awesome. When it's not, she's awesomely bad. |
Announcers and fans think if you bring the ball up the court, you are "playing the point" or you are " demonstrating point guard skills." Saying such a thing demonstrates either a fundamental lack of knowledge of the sport (specifically, the position) or a need to demonstrate how great the women's game is by making every player seem some fundamentally sound and versatile enough to play multiple positions. |
So I am one of those fans, based on never having played basketball and relying on the announcers to teach me the game. So how about a primer for someone like me? How can I tell when someone is actually playing point guard asa opposed to bringing the ball up and initiating the offense? |
Let me make this very easy for you. If you watched the NC game on Tuesday, you saw Diggins and Novosel play. I assume. Therefore, you saw a point guard play (aka Diggins) and you saw a shooting guard play (aka Novosel).
Diggins had the ball in her hands a LOT and directed people where to go and when and then either scored or passed it to initate the offensive set.
Novosel shot the ball 11 times. She doesn't (and isn't capable) of doing the things Diggins does for ND on offense (and can't guard PGs either).
Diggins = point guard (really a combo guard b/c she can also play shooting guard which accounts for the 17 shot attempts)
Novosel = shooting guard
Under no circumstances should you ever confuse the two as far as these two players are concerned. Novosel has never been a point guard in any of her 4 years at Notre Dame (and likely never in her life). To call her a PG is a sign the women's game is still not respected and allowed to be made a mockery of without recourse.
Now if you watch UConn play it's a different story, their system is predicated on multiple ball handlers, multiple passers, multiple shooters. Every guard at UConn needs to be a hybrid or combo guard in order to succeed. There is a reason multiple players average anywhere from 3-5 assists every season and why the scoring is typically spread out. It's because it's a motion offense where the ball continues to be passed around until the best shot becomes available. Very rarely is there a need for a guard to post up with the strong side of the floor cleared out or a "play" run for a specific player. But the system is adjusted year by year due to personnel (i.e. - more "plays" were run to get Maya shots last year just due to the fact that you want the best player in the country and by far the best on your team taking a majority of the shots...at least in BIG games whereas this season it went back to the str8-up motion because there was no star and the guards at UConn struggle with post-entry passing therefore they couldn't jsut pound it into Dolson night after night -- however they did a brilliant job of getting her the ball in the Final 4 match-up -- best I saw all season -- so I am holding out hope that next year can be different especially with the arrival of true PG Jefferson, and good post-passing posts Stewart and Tuck). |
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MNfan22
Joined: 20 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/05/12 6:11 pm ::: |
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| ClayK wrote: |
| Peters: How tall is she? She's slender, so if she's not a legit 6-2, I can't see her surviving in the WNBA paint. Ashley Walker, at 6-1, was one of the best rebounders I've ever seen, but she just wasn't big enough to make it. I don't think Peters has a perimeter game, so she has to make it happen inside, and if Walker couldn't, can she? |
Well actually, I see "slender" posts in the W as more the norm then the exception. Peters worked hard to get that body 'down' to the shape her frame is in, so her frame is a plus for her not a negative. Maybe not being slender enough was, part, of A. Walkers problem ?
I don’t know Peters legit height but the WNBA is full of 6-1 post players (which includes some of the one who teams have generously listed at 6-2  ) And I'm curious how many of the college posts in this draft have what one might refer to as a solid perimeter game ? I don't think anyone needs all the fingers on 1 hand to count 'em up
From what I've seen of this class, a side from Nneka being far and away the most polished of the group, ALL the post in this draft need to work on their offensive games. At the least both Peters & G. Johnson, with their slender frames, have shown a willingness to defend & do some work down low, so that's a plus for the slender girls  I’d expect who ever drafts them expects to work with them on their offense games. Putting the Olympic break to good use.
Whoever my Lynx select is going to get A LOT of practice time & have to work hard to earn game minuets. I still wouldn’t have a problem if my Lynx selected Peters, (for the role that I see our 5th post playing).
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tfan
Joined: 31 May 2010
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| Posted: 04/06/12 2:02 am ::: |
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| ClayK wrote: |
Novosel: So imagine it's late in the game, tie score, and Cappie Pondexter is bringing the ball up -- and she's being guarded by Natalie Novosel. And then, after Pondexter scores, Novosel is guarded by Pondexter.
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That seems to be an extremely high bar. How many players in the history of the WNBA would safely pass the test of "being able to guard Cappie Pondexter at the end of the game"? I believe Deanna Nolan failed that test in the 2007 finals.
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